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Kirk the Monstrously Informative Batboy

G-Fafif Apr 27 2007 05:40 PM

The former Met batboy (1985-1995) turned dealer (1995-2005) who talked... http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/27/AR2007042701332.html?hpid=topnews

Johnny Dickshot Apr 27 2007 05:42 PM

news travels fast!

Johnny Dickshot Apr 27 2007 05:43 PM

]Former Mets Employee Distributed Steroids By Amy Shipley Washington Post Staff Writer Friday, April 27, 2007; 4:13 PM SAN FRANCISCO, April 27 -- A former employee of the New York Mets admitted to distributing a variety of performance-enhancing drugs, including anabolic steroids and human growth hormone, to dozens of Major League Baseball players over a 10-year period beginning in 1995, according to a plea agreement filed in federal court Friday. Kirk J. Radomski, a personal trainer who said he worked for the Mets from 1985-95, agreed to cooperate with the group led by former Sen. George Mitchell that Major League Baseball appointed to investigate drug use in baseball, as part of a plea deal accepted at the U.S. District Court in the Northern District of California Friday by Judge Susan Illston. Radomski, 37, admitted to supplying drugs to players throughout the league and laundering the proceeds of those sales. He pleaded guilty to one count of distributing anabolic steroids and one count of felony money laundering and faces up to 25 years in prison and $500,000 in fines. A confidential informant told the FBI that Radomski was a major drug source in professional baseball who took over after the steroid bust of the Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative (BALCO) in 2003, according to a federal search warrant affadavit filed in connection with the case. "This individual was a major dealer of anabolic steroids and performance-enhancing drugs whose clientele was focused almost exclusively on Major League Baseball players," assistant U.S. Attorney Matt Parrella said after Radomski entered the plea. "He operated for approximately a decade." Parrella said Radomski was a batboy, clubhouse assistant and equipment manager for the Mets. The BALCO investigation resulted in five criminal convictions and more than a dozen doping suspensions of track and field athletes. It also led to a perjury investigation of San Francisco Giants slugger Barry Bonds, and indictments of track coach Trevor Graham and former cyclist Tammy Thomas. As part of the plea deal, Radomski agreed to testify at any grand jury proceeding requested by the government and participate in undercover activities under the supervision of law enforcment officials. The indictment represents a signficant blow to Major League Baseball, which has been trying to shake free of the drug scandal as Bonds approaches the all-time Major Leaugue home run record, which he is expected to eclipse this summer. No Major League Baseball players were identified in the court filings associated with the case, but names and paragraphs of text were redacted from the federal search warrant affadavit filed in December 2005. The affadavit listed 23 checks worth more than $30,000 that federal investigators alleged were deposited by individuals associated with Major League Baseball into Radomski's personal bank account between May 2003, and March 2005. The search warrant alleged that a confidential source received five orders of anabolic steroids from Radomski. Human growth hormone, anabolic steroids, clomiphene, insulin growth factor and clenbuterol were seized from Radomski's New York home on Dec. 14, 2005. Jeff Novitzky, an IRS special agent who has been the lead investigator on the BALCO case, wrote in the affadavit that he received a tip about Radomski from a confidential FBI source in Feburary 2005. The source placed the first of five drug orders from Radomski through an unidentifed Major League Baseball contact on March 19, 2005.

SteveJRogers Apr 27 2007 09:32 PM

="Amy Shipley Washington Post Staff Writer"]. Kirk J. Radomski, a personal trainer who said he worked for the Mets from 1985-95 Parrella said Radomski was a batboy, clubhouse assistant and equipment manager for the Mets.

Not to challenge the veracity of the case and all, but, ummm...

There are only 2 Equipment Managers I can validate in Met history:
Herb Norman 1962-1965, 1973-1983 (He could very well have been there from 66-72 but the position isn't listed in any Met publication that I own) and of course
Charlie Samuels 1984-

John Rufino was Samuels assistant from 85-87 then Vinny Greco took over who was in the Assistant role at least untill the early 00's

And Tony Carullo as far as I can tell is the only person listed as Clubhouse Manager during those years as well (The Visiting Clubhouse Mgr is listed, I guess Herb and Chuck were the "official" Mgrs of the home clubhouse.

Of course I wouldn't put it past a Government Rat (not saying he's doing a bad thing, but he is trying to save his own skin here) to puff up his own bio to make himself look more important or something, but please, can the Washington Post do some research to back up those facts? Call the Mets, I'm sure Charlie Samuels would love to tell them every assistant he ever had. I'm sure you could get your hands on people with media guides spanning the years he said he worked for the Mets (i.e. people who cover the Mets maybe)

Thats a big example of sloppy journalism right there.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 27 2007 09:38 PM

It's also a mistake for a reader to interpret a descriptive term for an official job title. It's vague, and that's the writer's fault but not a bungling of facts, necessarily. I sincerely doubt your theory that he lied to boost his profile. He's not even talking to the Post as far as I can tell.

SteveJRogers Apr 27 2007 09:58 PM

Fair point, though if you are telling a US Goverment Official certain information during an interrogation, isn't it better to say that you were higher up on a food chain than you actually were. Kind of makes the case a tad more explosive coming from someone who worked with a high ranking title than just a part-time employee member of the rank & file, basically working season-to-season rather than a full fledged member of the New York Mets organization.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 27 2007 10:07 PM

Yes, lying while trying to beat criminal charges is a great strategy.

Kid Carsey Apr 27 2007 10:07 PM

Steve, the guy's looking at getting twenty-five years in the big house. You think the Feds care what his titles were or that the guy is trying to impress them by embellishing his resume?

Edgy DC Apr 27 2007 11:02 PM

You know, part of Sandy Alomar's job is instructing infielders, but he doesn't have the title of Infield Instructor.

iramets Apr 28 2007 06:47 AM

You guys are looking at a story headed "Former Mets Employee Distributed Steroids" and you're focusing on his job title? Big picture, fellas, big picture--whose name is he gonna name? That's the question here. He may have worked in the visiting clubhouse, but he clearly knew the Met players--you gotta figure he sold steroids to some of them. The question is --WHO? HoJo? Strawberry? K-Mac? Some big Mets-heroes are shitting bricks this morning, I promise you that. Be prepared to re-think your admiration for some Mets, or alternatively to rethink your scorn for rationalizing Giants fans because you're about to start offering up some of their weaker justifications for Bonds' big head. (I never really understood how you get your skull to grow, BTW--I don't see how bone or scalp responds to exercise, but that's a whole nother story.)

Frayed Knot Apr 28 2007 08:04 AM

Of course the timeline says that he worked for the Mets for a certain time and then went into dealing which, if true, might not make NYM players anymore nervous than others. Remember that the Pittsburgh clubhouse caterer caught dealing recreational drugs in the '80s seemed to be an equal opportunity implicator. I suspect there's more than a couple nervous players all over MLB on account of this. Great subject heading, btw.

Johnny Dickshot Apr 28 2007 08:13 AM

You guys = Rogers I wouldn't guess there'd be many of us who'd be surprised to have found some former Mets *cough* Hundley! *cough* of that era who were users, and many since. I mentally adjust for the Questionable Training Era to have begun in say, 1988.

iramets Apr 28 2007 08:19 AM

Johnny Dickshot wrote: You guys = Rogers I wouldn't guess there'd be many of us who'd be surprised to have found some former Mets *cough* Hundley! *cough* of that era who were users, and many since. I mentally adjust for the Questionable Training Era to have begun in say, 1988. Well, Rogers wasn't the only one discussing the job title, as if the real scandal had to do with his misrepresenting his resume. Just getting the conversation back on track, is all. Your coughing spasm brings to mind all of the vague allegations about Hundley, in which BV made some cryptic "lifestyle" comments that were never really clear. Now maybe we'll understand?

Frayed Knot Apr 28 2007 08:37 AM

I think the Valentine/Hundley comments were mostly about late nights and drinking - something Hundley pretty much copped to later on. Not that roids in addition to that would surprise me, but I doubt that was specifically what BV was talking about. Roids + Met will always equal Dykstra in my mind

Kid Carsey Apr 28 2007 08:37 AM

I was going to remind ira that fellas is plural and it's Roger's silly rant. ira: Be prepared to re-think your admiration for some Mets, or alternatively to rethink your scorn for rationalizing Giants fans because you're about to start offering up some of their weaker justifications for Bonds' big head. Seriously, why do you talk to us like you're on one level of understanding and the rest of us are just a peg or two below or a step or two behind you? It's a real turn-off. I ain't gonna re-think anything if a couple of ex-Mets were juicers and there's little if no comparison to Bonds' fans.

Kid Carsey Apr 28 2007 08:41 AM

Bingo on Dykstra, classic example.

iramets Apr 28 2007 08:48 AM

Kid Carsey wrote: Seriously, why do you talk to us like you're on one level of understanding and the rest of us are just a peg or two below or a step or two behind you? I dunno, maybe because you "ain't gonna re-think anything" including your pride in watching the Mets compete even if it's someday demonstrated that steroids were invented in Wilpon's laboratory, and that they've been pushing juice for decades out of Shea. The Mets have stayed pretty clean, Mota aside, and their fans have taken pleasure out of castigating Bonds and Giambi and such, without much blowback. That may be changing soon. I know you're fully prepared to go, "Oh that's all in the past, and who cares about ancient history--LGM!!" but some people might feel tainted by a steroid scandal. Not you, I understand.

iramets Apr 28 2007 08:51 AM

Frayed Knot wrote: Roids + Met will always equal Dykstra in my mind Didn't Dykstra get all pumped up all as a Phillie, though? Statisticaly, he stayed pretty steady during his Met career, and only turned into a monster (literally and figuratively) when his cap turned red, right?

SteveJRogers Apr 28 2007 08:51 AM

iramets wrote: You guys are looking at a story headed "Former Mets Employee Distributed Steroids" and you're focusing on his job title? Big picture, fellas, big picture--whose name is he gonna name? That's the question here. He may have worked in the visiting clubhouse, but he clearly knew the Met players--you gotta figure he sold steroids to some of them. The question is --WHO? HoJo? Strawberry? K-Mac? Some big Mets-heroes are shitting bricks this morning, I promise you that. Be prepared to re-think your admiration for some Mets, or alternatively to rethink your scorn for rationalizing Giants fans because you're about to start offering up some of their weaker justifications for Bonds' big head. (I never really understood how you get your skull to grow, BTW--I don't see how bone or scalp responds to exercise, but that's a whole nother story.) I think some Met fans have done that when we resigned Mota while he was under suspension!

SteveJRogers Apr 28 2007 08:53 AM

iramets wrote: ="Frayed Knot"]Roids + Met will always equal Dykstra in my mind Didn't Dykstra get all pumped up all as a Phillie, though? Statisticaly, he stayed pretty steady during his Met career, and only turned into a monster (literally and figuratively) when his cap turned red, right? It started after the 1986 season, he really became homer happy and showed up in ST of 1987 alot bulkier

Kid Carsey Apr 28 2007 08:55 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Apr 28 2007 08:59 AM

ira: >>>I know you're fully prepared to go, "Oh that's all in the past, and who cares about ancient history--LGM!!"<<< Overly mis characterizing some us as pom-pom wavers is pretty old and a turn off as well. It's this dismissive tone and lumping the forum in general at times into one big heap of people who are blinded by something you imagine that makes me freakin' nuts. I just had an epiphany, I think. Maybe it's gas.

iramets Apr 28 2007 08:55 AM

SteveJRogers wrote: I think some Met fans have done that when we resigned Mota while he was under suspension! Yeah, and that's been pretty well rationalized with "Well, he 'fessed up, not like these lying creeps like Bonds or these evasive motherfuckers llike Giambi--he admitted what he done, like a real man does, takes his punishment, and when he's done with his suspension, we're going to welcome him back as a returnng hero, who's done his time and whose soul is as clean as a hound's tooth! LGM!" A little tougher if you find out your clubhouse has been Steroid Central for a decade or so.

SteveJRogers Apr 28 2007 08:59 AM

iramets wrote: Well, Rogers wasn't the only one discussing the job title, as if the real scandal had to do with his misrepresenting his resume. Just getting the conversation back on track, is all. To be fair my concern is more about slipshod journalism and/or copyediting on the article and a wrong assumption that a guy facing 25 years would lie about his resume to better the case.

iramets Apr 28 2007 09:02 AM

Kid Carsey wrote: some us as pom-pom wavers. No, just you. i wouldn't want to make the mistake of characterizing all CPFers with the same tar-brush I'm using on your remarks. Sometimes it's easier to see what we're talking bout without all those goddamned pom-poms in my face. My point --where's that sig line from CF, anyway?--is that if you're prepared to castigate the Yankees for benefiting from steroid abuse, and claim some higher pedestral for your team's honesty, you may have to ask them to move over a bit to make room for you right next to them, if this story breaks as I'm thinking it might. I'm asking if you're prepared for that somewhat humbling exercise. Clearly, you're not.

Iubitul Apr 28 2007 09:15 AM

Actually, three names immediately pop into my mind when I think of Mets and steroids - the aforementioned Hundley and Dykstra - Steve is correct - Dykstra got homer happy after his '86 post-season heroics, and showed up in '87 a lot bulkier... The third name? Rey Ordonez.

Iubitul Apr 28 2007 09:20 AM

iramets wrote: HoJo? Strawberry? K-Mac? K-Mac? Mr. body-by-McDonalds? ROFLMAO Strawberry? I doubt that - he was always lean and muscular from the time he came up - his body type never really changed while he was with the Mets. Hojo? That could be possible - that could explain his shoulder problems...

Kid Carsey Apr 28 2007 10:54 AM

ira: >>>i wouldn't want to make the mistake of characterizing all CPFers with the same tar-brush I'm using on your remarks. Sometimes it's easier to see what we're talking bout without all those goddamned pom-poms in my face. My point --where's that sig line from CF, anyway?--is that if you're prepared to castigate the Yankees for benefiting from steroid abuse, and claim some higher pedestral for your team's honesty, you may have to ask them to move over a bit to make room for you right next to them, if this story breaks as I'm thinking it might. I'm asking if you're prepared for that somewhat humbling exercise. Clearly, you're not.<<< Pass the pipe, I wanna get high too, must be some powerful shit. I don't castigate the Yankee benefiting from steroids ... you're making stuff up. I have made fun of Gee I Am Bi's neck being the size of Mo Vaughn's left butt check ... and it was. Humbling exercise? Where's the lighter? It's out. I have no horse in the Hojostramac was a juicer race. Higher pedestal for your team's honesty? Where do you get this stuff?

Edgy DC Apr 28 2007 02:30 PM

iramets wrote: ="Johnny Dickshot"]You guys = Rogers I wouldn't guess there'd be many of us who'd be surprised to have found some former Mets *cough* Hundley! *cough* of that era who were users, and many since. I mentally adjust for the Questionable Training Era to have begun in say, 1988. Well, Rogers wasn't the only one discussing the job title, as if the real scandal had to do with his misrepresenting his resume. Just getting the conversation back on track, is all. Which is exactly what the rest of us were trying to do with Rogers' tack. I think it's pretty near established already that HoJo has cheated. The problem is not the pom-poms in your face.

iramets Apr 28 2007 02:46 PM

Kid Carsey wrote: I have made fun of Gee I Am Bi's neck being the size of Mo Vaughn's left butt check ... and it was. Where do you get this stuff? From you, of course. If you've made fun of various Yankees suspected of steroid use, and you have (what? you're mocking Giambi's neck size but not the reason for it? Get off it), then I'd like to hear similar mockery directed at various Mets if they're accused in the coming weeks on the same basis as you mocked Giambi. What's that? You're not an equal opportunity mocker? That's okay, I am.

Kid Carsey Apr 28 2007 03:04 PM

Whatever. I'm gonna go sulk in the corner knowing my slice of humble pie is in the oven. Sheesh.

Edgy DC Apr 29 2007 12:49 AM

Anybody subscribe to ESPN Magazine. Supposedly Tom Farrey has a story with Brian McRae spilling something about the Mets locker room of that era.

Elster88 Apr 29 2007 01:27 AM

The author is Tom Farrey. It was on ESPN's website but now I can't find it. I did a search on Tom Farrey and the article was the first result but the link is broken. Try again tomorrow.

Elster88 Apr 29 2007 01:27 AM

The author is Tom Farrey. It was on ESPN's website but now I can't find it. I did a search of ESPN.com on Tom Farrey and the article was the first result but the link is broken. Try again tomorrow.

G-Fafif Apr 29 2007 01:31 AM

FYI: ESPN says the story is updated as of November 9, 2005, though there is reference to Kirk the monstrously informative non-equipment manager and his Friday plea agreement. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=farrey_tom&id=2852405&lpos=spotlight&lid=tab2pos2 ]Editor's note: In November 2005, Congress released the results of its investigation into steroid use by Rafael Palmiero. The report described reckless and illegal use of prescription drugs in the Baltimore Orioles' locker room. In 1999, a similar scene was unfolding in the New York Mets' locker room, as Tom Farrey reports in this bonus coverage from ESPN The Magazine's examination of steroid abuse. The drugs arrived with the fan mail, delivered in little packages indistinguishable from the letters sent by kids asking for autographs. At his sparsely decorated locker beneath Shea Stadium, Brian McRae would open the envelope and take out the brown plastic bottle of painkillers a pharmacist had sent him without a prescription. He would remove two of the small, white pills, pop them into his mouth, take a few gulps of water and continue to prepare for that night's game. It was early in 1999, his 10th season in the majors, and he was hardly the only Met with a rogue pharmacist. "We didn't feel like we were doing anything illegal," he said. "It just felt like circumventing the system." McRae, who played with five major league teams from 1990-99, tells ESPN The Magazine that the Mets of the late 1990s can be added to the list of drugged-up teams. McRae knew drugs were everywhere in baseball, but in New York, he said, everything seemed easier to get. High-octane painkillers that he obtained illegally from a local pharmacist were McRae's tonic, but the clubhouse was awash with amphetamines, and the veteran center fielder has never heard more talk about steroids. No one spoke openly about shooting up, but it wasn't hard to guess who was on the juice. And no one was pointing fingers. Instead, the same question was often asked on planes, in bars, in card games: Would you take something that gets you a $20 million deal but eventually kills you? The usual answer: Sure, if I could help my family. It had always been so. McRae grew up in the clubhouse of the Kansas City Royals, where his father Hal starred and later managed, fetching bats, shagging balls, getting to know Amos Otis, George Brett and Willie Wilson. He watched catchers dab pine tar on their shin guards to help pitchers get a better grip on breaking balls. After he was drafted by K.C. in 1987, he knew A-ball teammates who hardened their bats with polyurethane. To McRae, steroids were just the latest form of cheating, and most players didn't object. "On the Mets, you were a definite outcast if you didn't do amphetamines," said Turk Wendell, McRae's teammate on the Mets, who also pitched for the Cubs, Phillies and Rockies. "I was an outcast. There was a player on the Mets who fell down on the field with what they called an irregular heartbeat. Just fell down while playing his position. "I had one player on another team talk to me about steroids and how great they were," he said. "He gave me the whole ins and outs and how you do it. He said you get addicted because you see the direct results. There are some pitchers I know who did steroids. One guy I know told me that was the only reason he got drafted. He went from 85 to 92 or 94 [mph] by taking steroids. These guys love it because of the instant results." On Friday, the U.S. Attorney's office in San Francisco released a plea agreement reached last week with a former clubhouse attendant with the New York Mets who admitted to distributing anabolic steroids and other performance-enhancing drugs to Major League Baseball players. None of the players or their associated teams was named, but Kirk Radomski, who was with the Mets from 1985 to 1995, admitted to providing anabolic steroids, human growth hormone and amphetamines to players on teams throughout the majors in the decade after he left the Mets. Steroids had been banned in baseball since 1991, although few players knew about the policy. But there was no drug-testing agreement in place between ownership and the union providing the mechanism to catch cheaters. McRae, a union rep at the time, said few players were eager to add one, as well. "My attitude was, guys are going to cheat, whether they're testing or not," McRae said. "I just did my thing and didn't worry too much about it. That was one issue I didn't have an opinion on. You know, it's your body; if you want to destroy it, you destroy it. There are people who destroy their bodies with pain pills, overeating, tobacco, all kinds of things. They're grown men." Without testing, Steve Phillips, the Mets' GM at the time and now an ESPN baseball analyst, said he was reluctant to patrol his clubhouse like a vigilante cop. "I had suspicions about individual players here and there, but it was one of those situations that you didn't ask about [because] there was nothing you could do if they said no," Phillips says. "My attitude as a GM was, I want a level playing field. If other teams were doing it, I wasn't going to go through my clubhouse and look in every shoebox. I wasn't proposing that my guys use it, but I also wasn't going to propose that the Mets be the only clean team in baseball. I couldn't go back to my owner and say, 'We tried to beat these teams full of big guys with our little skinny guys.'" Eventually, McRae began to research steroids. He liked his job. So after games, he would bring his questions into the workout room at Shea, where Barry Heyden, the team's strength coach, could often be found tapping away on his desktop computer. McRae didn't want to juice up, but creatine and other EAS-brand supplements hadn't given him the muscle gains of other players with apparently more clandestine methods. Early in his career, it had taken McRae five years to add 15 pounds to his frame, less than what some players around baseball were picking up over one winter in the late '90s. "What's the difference between taking them orally and injecting?" McRae asked Heyden. "I hear it's safer to take them orally." And Heyden, he said, gave him answers. Honest answers. Yes, they work, but the long-term health effects could be harmful. "He wasn't trying to turn you on to things," McRae said. "He was trying to educate guys." Heyden, who left the team in 2001 and no longer works in baseball, told ESPN The Magazine that he "just told them about the side effects" of steroids and never condoned their use. McRae was intrigued but ultimately opted against steroids. He stayed away from "greenies" (amphetamines) out of fear of his family history of heart problems. All along, his plan was to play 10 years in the big leagues and get out with his body intact. But by midseason of '99, his body was no longer responding the way it once had. All the games, all the flights had taken a toll. He'd hit 20 home runs and stolen 22 bases in '98, but both his bat and his legs had slowed, and there was nothing the painkillers could do about that. With his batting average slipping to the .220s and flyballs falling out of his reach, he knew the end of his time with the Mets could be near. It came on an August road trip against the Cubs at Wrigley Field, when he was pulled aside during the game and told he had just been traded to the Rockies. McRae changed into street clothes, gathered his belongings and, in lieu of goodbyes, wrote a message on the board to his teammates: "Have fun and good luck. Don't forget me when playoff time comes." Tom Farrey is a senior writer with ESPN The Magazine

iramets Apr 29 2007 05:09 AM

"There was a player on the Mets who fell down on the field with what they called an irregular heartbeat. Just fell down while playing his position." Seems to me we could ID this Met if we tried. Doesn't seen to happen too often, falling down at your position, does it?

iramets Apr 29 2007 05:16 AM

]Without testing, Steve Phillips, the Mets' GM at the time and now an ESPN baseball analyst, said he was reluctant to patrol his clubhouse like a vigilante cop. "I had suspicions about individual players here and there, but it was one of those situations that you didn't ask about [because] there was nothing you could do if they said no," Phillips says. "My attitude as a GM was, I want a level playing field. If other teams were doing it, I wasn't going to go through my clubhouse and look in every shoebox. I wasn't proposing that my guys use it, but I also wasn't going to propose that the Mets be the only clean team in baseball. I couldn't go back to my owner and say, 'We tried to beat these teams full of big guys with our little skinny guys.'" So this is Phillips telling us he deliberately chose to turn a blilnd eye to steroids on the Mets because winning was more important to him than winning honestly, and doing right by his players, protecting their long-term health, etc. Personally, I'd rather the Mets fielded a team of skinny merinks, went 0-162 and brought steroid-use to a head, but Steve didn't share my values, I guess.

SteveJRogers Apr 29 2007 07:30 AM

The sad thing is, that describes every GM/high ranking front office official over the last 20 years. I mean like people weren't suspect of the late 80's-early 90's A's? Didn't the Padre GM know about Caminiti in 98-ish but didn't bother to tell anyone untill all the stories were breaking in the last few years? And people wonder why there are those who think baseball is a dying sport!

Iubitul Apr 29 2007 07:33 AM

This was a crap article that was originally written 18 months ago, and had a paragraph added to make it more current. Crap, pure crap.

metirish Apr 29 2007 10:38 AM

One of the Balco boys got drugs from this fella,so says Lupica on Sports Reporters.

iramets Apr 29 2007 11:00 AM

Iubitul wrote: This was a crap article that was originally written 18 months ago, and had a paragraph added to make it more current. Crap, pure crap. What sense of "crap" do you mean? That it's all untrue? That you didn't enjoy reading it? That some of it is untrue?

Iubitul Apr 29 2007 11:47 AM

iramets wrote: ="Iubitul"]This was a crap article that was originally written 18 months ago, and had a paragraph added to make it more current. Crap, pure crap. What sense of "crap" do you mean? That it's all untrue? That you didn't enjoy reading it? That some of it is untrue? ha ha - nice try. That it was written 18 months ago, and had one paragraph added to make it seem current. Pure laziness.

iramets Apr 29 2007 03:20 PM

Do you realize the Declaration of Independence was writtten over 240 years ago? And has never been updated, even a paragraph? Is it crap too?

Iubitul Apr 29 2007 03:27 PM

iramets wrote: Do you realize the Declaration of Independence was writtten over 240 years ago? And has never been updated, even a paragraph? Is it crap too? Obviously, a mathematician you're not... The point here, in case it's too subtle for you do understand, is that this is being presented as if it is new, which it isn't. That is what makes it crap.

iramets Apr 29 2007 03:36 PM

Oh, right. I meant 230. I guess it must be crap then. iIdon't get it. if it was true 18 months ago, and was printed (or reprinted) yesterday, why does that make it crap? If it contans things that are no longer true, that's one thing. But you seem to be calling it crap without showing what it says that's wrong, or misleading, or mistaken.

Kid Carsey Apr 29 2007 03:54 PM

SJR: >>>And people wonder why there are those who think baseball is a dying sport<<< My recollection is that people wonder why you think it.

A Boy Named Seo Apr 29 2007 04:15 PM

Phillips seems to go from admitting in the previous article that he turned the other cheek because everyone else is was doing it to now just being a little naive. ]"I had suspicions about individual players here and there, but it was one of those situations that you didn't ask about [because] there was nothing you could do if they said no," Phillips says. "My attitude as a GM was, I want a level playing field. If other teams were doing it, I wasn't going to go through my clubhouse and look in every shoebox. I wasn't proposing that my guys use it, but I also wasn't going to propose that the Mets be the only clean team in baseball. I couldn't go back to my owner and say, ':We tried to beat these teams full of big guys with our little skinny guys.'" Article [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2853067]today[/url]: ]I was often accused of being in the Mets' clubhouse too much during my years as general manager (1997-2003). I have to admit that I am hoping that there aren't any of my former players outed by this process as it would indicate that not only was I in the clubhouse too much but that I was also deaf and blind.

Edgy DC Apr 29 2007 04:19 PM

Phillips, man. Victory before honor.

Edgy DC Apr 30 2007 09:24 AM

"We were surprised and disappointed to learn of the guilty plea today. The conduct in question is diametrically opposed to the values and standards of the Mets organization and our owners. We are and always have been adamantly opposed to the use of performance-enhancing drugs and continue to support Major League Baseball's efforts to eradicate any such use in our game." --- Mets team statement "If other teams were doing it, I wasn't going to go through my clubhouse and look in every shoebox. I wasn't proposing that my guys use it, but I also wasn't going to propose that the Mets be the only clean team in baseball. I couldn't go back to my owner and say, ':We tried to beat these teams full of big guys with our little skinny guys.'" --- Steve Phillips statmtent