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Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 07:23 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 26 2007 07:39 AM

I'm calling a meeting of the offense. Listen, everyone saw what we did lin the ninth ast night. You know we can do that. I know we can do that. Here's the thing. We have to do that. All the time. Not wait for no too-late ninth innng. No getting our runs early, and letting the pen take over. We can't let them pick us up. No staying close with starting pitching and getting our runs late. We can't let them pick us up. Maybe the pitchers will get their shit together and maybe they won't, but we can't concern ourselves with that. As it stands now, we're gonna have to bop our way home. I don't know what the fuck, but we're clearly not a complete team right now. But you, me, us, we're a complete offense. Power, speed, OBP, contact, rookies , vets, pull hitters, spray hitters. Starters, bench players, we've waited until it was necessary to show it, but we're a complete offense, with the most complete hitter in the league in the middle, and we have to show it every inning of every night, because the other gangs, er, teams are getting theirs. Anything short of double digits is pathetic. Starting tonight, we're the Big Red Machine, we're Harvey's Wallbangers, we're Murderer's Row. We're the Warriors, and we're gonna bop our way home from Van Cortland Park to Coney Island. It's gonna be bloody and it's gonna be glorious. I'm sick of waiting for trains.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 07:36 AM

(Manny Acta)You see, Warriors? You see what you get when you mess with the Orphans?!?(/Manny Acta)

Willets Point Sep 26 2007 07:57 AM

I think your memo is a month late. The pitching is shit now. The offense is averaging 5.5 runs per game in September but the pitchers allow 5.75. Yeah, you can push the offense to slug it out, but I think the entire pitching staff deserves a dressing down too.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 08:03 AM

The starters need to do what Oliver Perez did the other day. Pitch deep into the game while holding the opposition to few runs. I know that's easier said than done, but the Mets just haven't been doing it. Other than Perez on Saturday, when was the last time a Mets starter went seven innings? If it's happened more than twice since the Phillies came to Shea I'd be surprised.

soupcan Sep 26 2007 08:05 AM

I love to see Humber toss a gem tonight then go over to Glavine and say 'Eat me.'

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 08:10 AM

Willets Point wrote: I think your memo is a month late. The pitching is shit now. The offense is averaging 5.5 runs per game in September but the pitchers allow 5.75. Yeah, you can push the offense to slug it out, but I think the entire pitching staff deserves a dressing down too. You can call a pitchers meeting to hash that out. This is the offense meeting, and we're proceeding from this point as if the pitching staff is going to give us nothing. Based on them having given us nothing.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 08:16 AM

I think the memo is on point. As many runs as the Mets scored recently the O has still been sputtery, taking too many innings off and making too many boneheaded plays and poor execution. Shawn Green in the second inning last night had a 13-pitch at-bat. The following inning, the Mets' 2, 3 and 4 hitters went down on 13 pitches total! We went down on 9 pitches in the 4th and 11 pitches in the 8th. Not good offense despite what the runs column says.

Willets Point Sep 26 2007 08:24 AM

Yes, and Jose Reyes is a lazy good-for-nothing loafer. I know your spiel already.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 08:25 AM

Before that ninth-inning rally, we hit into double palys in three in four (or was it four in five) previous innings. I don't want any of that shit. Yeah, I'll give you that Ryan Zimmerman pulled one out of his ass. He gave us that back when he had Endy Chavez dead to rights in the ninth and decided to fall on his face instead. Wright, whose contribution to the rally was driving a ball pitched out of the strikezone, had two of those DPs. I don't want to be living and dying alternately on the largesse and stinginess of no Ryan Zimmerman. I want his neck to hurt from watching balls fly past him.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 08:28 AM

Willets Point wrote: Yes, and Jose Reyes is a lazy good-for-nothing loafer. I know your spiel already. Spiel? Would you care to double-check my math?

Willets Point Sep 26 2007 08:33 AM

I already know you have nothing but hate for the Mets and Reyes in particular. Previous reasoned arguments have done nothing to stop you from spraying angry shit around this forum.

Vic Sage Sep 26 2007 08:38 AM

"Metsies....(clink, clink)... come out to playyyyy-ayyyy..." (clink, clink) "METsies! ....(clink, clink)... Come out to PLAYyyy-ayyyy!" (clink, clink) "METSIES!!....(clink, clink)... come out to PLAYYYYY-AYYYY!" (clink, clink)

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 08:40 AM

I hate the Mets, so facts I look up are incorrect. Gotcha.

Vic Sage Sep 26 2007 08:41 AM

Willets Point wrote: I already know you have nothing but hate for the Mets and Reyes in particular. Previous reasoned arguments have done nothing to stop you from spraying angry shit around this forum. WP, just because JD doesn't have his head up his ass doesn't make him a hater. He's a fanatic, just like the rest of us, but he recognizes when a player and/or a team is playing like crap and says so. A fart doesn't become perfume just because it gets blasted out of a ass painted orange and blue.

Willets Point Sep 26 2007 08:42 AM

Johnny Dickshot wrote: I hate the Mets, so facts I look up are incorrect. Gotcha. No you hate the Mets so you constantly spit venom and make this an unpleasant place to be.

metirish Sep 26 2007 08:45 AM

Willets Point wrote: ="Johnny Dickshot"]I hate the Mets, so facts I look up are incorrect. Gotcha. No you hate the Mets so you constantly spit venom and make this an unpleasant place to be. Really I have to disagree with that,couldn't be more wrong to me,I see frustration and a good deal of what JD posts is exactly how I feel......

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 08:54 AM

Well, nothing skews the sample like getting beaten up on by a second-divison team, so you may want to go back a few hours or days or months, but here are [url=http://cranepoolforum.net/phpbb2/search.php?search_author=Johnny+Dickshot]189 pages of Dickshot posts[/url].

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 09:07 AM

How venomous and unpleasant.

soupcan Sep 26 2007 09:45 AM

Wow. I guess I really need to read more and post less.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 10:57 AM

Ceasar's ghost, that exchange put a damper on posting this morning.

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 12:12 PM

Holy shipwrecked on a desert isle and turn on each other, Batman. Dickshot's like my favorite poster. metirish is the balls, except that he needs to hit the space bar after punctuation. Willet, did you hit your head when we landed?

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 12:24 PM

What's strange is that Willets, who traditionally has been more on the glass half empty side of the equation, is now the only one who's currently wearing his rose-colored glasses. Given the events of the last two weeks, it's perfectly natural to be a bit down on this team. All these repeated failures are very frustrating. To say we must speak no ill of the Mets because they're all our boys is the kind of pajama-and-Kool Aid talk that old whatsisname always accused us of.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 12:29 PM

It's probably irrelevant, but Willets is seriously on the baby clock right now. I know I'd be shitting live animals if I was in his position.

soupcan Sep 26 2007 12:34 PM

Edgy DC wrote: I know I'd be shitting live animals if I was in his position. Which is kinda what his wife is gonna be doing.

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 12:35 PM

Good one, soup. Laughter is the best medicine.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 12:39 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: What's strange is that Willets, who traditionally has been more on the glass half empty side of the equation, is now the only one who's currently wearing his rose-colored glasses. Only, there's more harsh criticism of the team in his first post of this thread than in anything, by anyone, that followed it.

Centerfield Sep 26 2007 12:50 PM

Hate the Mets guys. Not each other. This team full of shitballs forced us to root for Chipper Jones last night.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 12:50 PM

Maybe Astro Annie's kid cracked Willets' password.

metirish Sep 26 2007 12:53 PM

Only a no hitter by Humber can bring the love back I think.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 12:54 PM

I just meant to be encouraging, not to tear one unit or the other. I think every unit should be looking at themselves right now and seeing what they can do to sack up. Darling suggested last night that Wagner call the bullpen together, remind them they have a rookie pitching, and they'll be needed --- whether to bail out a bad effort or bring a good one home to full redemption --- and to remind them that they can put the last weeks behind them and do what they're capable of down the stretch. It's soul-searching time.

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 12:59 PM

Screw soul-searching, it's ass-kicking time. They can search their souls all winter.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 01:05 PM

Well, I think the soul-searching was scheduled for 2:00-3:00. Those with unfound souls will be asked to excuse themselves.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 01:06 PM

This really shouldn't be hard. All they have to do is win three of five from the Nationals, Cardinals and Marlins. That would at least clinch a tie and would require the Phillies to win all five of their remaining games, which probably won't happen. They REALLY should be able to go 3-2 against these opponents. It's a sign of how awful the Mets have been that this does seem like a daunting task.

seawolf17 Sep 26 2007 01:09 PM

Really? Just win tonight. Everything else will take care of itself... because then you're only talking about 2-2 over the next four. Just win, baby. By the way, this is my favorite thread in CPF history that doesn't involve Latvia.

metirish Sep 26 2007 01:12 PM

While I agree with Yancy I think Edgy is talking about us as a forum...we need the encouragement ,the soul-searching is for the forum....you can say stop anytime you want Edgy....

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 01:22 PM

Why not? Although, if you had looked deep within yourself, looked for that focus and direction and resilience to avoid the mental errors and sloppiness, why is there no space after your fecking comma?! Damn it, people, this is the big leagues.

seawolf17 Sep 26 2007 01:24 PM

And technically... only three dots in an ellipsis. But now I'm just being a grammar nerd.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 01:28 PM

Punctuation nerd, technically.

seawolf17 Sep 26 2007 01:31 PM

I can throw in spelling nerd too, if you'd like.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 01:34 PM

Thank you, no. How cool is it that John Stearns has a little 12 floating above his throwing shoulder?

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 01:37 PM

I dot dot dot the way I wanna dot dot dot and that ain't likely gonna change. I use dot dot dot to separate thoughts in sentences on forums and emails. Doesn't mean I'd misuse dot dot dot in professionul corespondince.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 01:52 PM

I've noticed, when editing and proofreading UMDB memories, that a lot of people use the three dots in lieu of a period. "I went to Shea last night...A guy was there who looked like Tim Teufel...It wasn't him but it looked like him...LOL!" Sometimes I can tell at a glance that the post will require a lot of editing. It takes me a much longer time to get around to those.

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 01:55 PM

Bummer ... that's gotta suck.

Valadius Sep 26 2007 02:19 PM

I think there's still hope left. We just gotta focus on us. Also, our bullpen needs to be better managed, and we gotta steal more bases. That's one thing that's been missing recently. But we've got plenty of hot bats.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 02:24 PM

I wouldn't be telling them to steal more bases. Some of the problems of the last two weeks have been caused by steal attempts in foolish situations.

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 02:27 PM

Could you imagine if that rally last night ended with Chavez getting thrown out at third? Obviously it didn't, but the WHAT IF'S would've go on from now until xmas if it mattered in the long run.

Valadius Sep 26 2007 02:29 PM

We just need to look for better situations to steal in, then. Could be a one-run or two-run difference to each ballgame.

soupcan Sep 26 2007 02:34 PM

Um, fellas? The offense ain't the problem.

Vic Sage Sep 26 2007 03:01 PM

how dare you state the obvious?

Zvon Sep 26 2007 03:02 PM

So its come to this. Im a big fan of both Willits and J.D. and its a sad day when I see them bitch slappin each other. Great thing about this forum is it takes all kinds. Attitudes, opinions, perspectives, ....experiences. Some will be positive, some median, some negative. Some over the top, some under the radar. I don't think I can remember a season in which I expected more and was served an easy glide from the gate up until,.... I guess the Phils 4 game sweep in Philly. Then it became a roller coaster ride that has led into a nightmaresk haunted house. Yea, we are feeling it----the pressure. And we are just fans, lol. Im a big fan of W.P.'s spirit and attitude, and J.D.s wit and wisdom. And I know you two have been fan's of each other long before I ever came along. This will all be over in a couple a days, one way or the other. Whether we are up, down, positive or pessimistic, we should all exercise empathy to a certain extent. And now, especially during these next few days, we should all stand together and take whatever is in store for us,... together. If its painful, it hurts less when we can water it down together with our very tears. If its jubilant, such joy will be magnified and multiplied as together, our tears of joy raise us all till our cup runneth over. Its a win / win situation for us. _______Fin~~~~~~~~~ Man, I can really lay it on when I want,Ha!. All I wanted to say was please stop snapping guys. Instead I waxed. Lets rally around Edgy's lead. If this was the 70's I'd sneak you into the Shea clubhouse to give that speech Edge. And Peterson is the one who should take time with the arm staff. Those words from Wags would be nice--these day's I don't see players stepping up like that. If Peterson is all that, now is the time to prove it. And I don't mean wave a magic wand and make things all right. I mean at least TRY and say the words that might help those arms realize that they are here because they are major league calibre arms. They already made the grade. After the pressure of this stretch, the post season will seem like a pajama party......if they make it.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2007 03:04 PM

="soupcan"]Um, fellas? The offense ain't the problem. Sure it is... in a way. Reyes is going as badly as he ever has in his career*, we seemingly can't stop making ill-advised baserunning dares**, we tend to have too many innings where we go down too easily***, we too often fail to execute the basics (get the guy over, score him from 2nd, etc etc) and as long as we know the pitching is a complete crapshoot we have to assume also that the O isn't good enough enough till we score 7 or 8 a night. *-Apparently he took xtra BP with Hojo prior to yesterday's 2HR performance... **-We damn near lost a third game in a month as the result of getting caught stealing 3rd with 2 outs. How is that offense that does that not a problem? ***-13, 9 and 11 pitch innings last night.

Valadius Sep 26 2007 03:13 PM

Having met Rick Peterson, having spent a good 10 minutes or so talking to him, I can tell you for certain that he's not the kind of guy that would inspire you. He might be able to show you things that could inspire you, but he can't do it himself. He doesn't have that kind of personality. He's more a stubborn, absent-minded professor who is quick to judge.

Kid Carsey Sep 26 2007 03:21 PM

Maybe you bored him and he couldn't wait for you to move on.

metirish Sep 26 2007 04:37 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 26 2007 04:43 PM

Valadius wrote: Having met Rick Peterson, having spent a good 10 minutes or so talking to him, I can tell you for certain that he's not the kind of guy that would inspire you. He might be able to show you things that could inspire you, but he can't do it himself. He doesn't have that kind of personality. He's more a stubborn, absent-minded professor who is quick to judge. Val please, all that you got in 10 minutes?, and you don't have to be able to do it yourself to be a good coach, and that has nothing to do with his personality but his lack of stuff.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 26 2007 04:38 PM

He spoke to him for 10 minutes (where have I heard that time measurement before?) and quickly judged that Rick Peterson is quick to judge.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 06:47 PM

I hope you were fixed. You're doing pretty well, Warriors. Don't let up.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2007 07:33 PM

Every inning, Warriors.

Elster88 Sep 26 2007 08:02 PM

Valadius wrote: Having met Rick Peterson, having spent a good 10 minutes or so talking to him, I can tell you for certain that he's not the kind of guy that would inspire you. He might be able to show you things that could inspire you, but he can't do it himself. He doesn't have that kind of personality. He's more a stubborn, absent-minded professor who is quick to judge. ...

Benjamin Grimm Sep 27 2007 06:00 AM

Elster leads the forum in silent responses. (Mostly, I think, to Valadius and Steve Rogers.) Anyway, back to business. The Mets are a miserable team, no doubt. If they should manage to stumble to the NLDS, they'll be heavy underdogs. (If they can't beat bad teams, how will they beat good teams.) But the NLDS remains a worthy goal anyway, and the Mets hopes are riding today on two future Hall-of-Fame pitchers. If Pedro Martinez can beat the Cardinals, and John Smoltz can beat the Phillies, we'll have a considerably better outlook tomorrow morning. The Mets are alive at least through Saturday's games. Whether they make the playoffs or not, this miserable final month of the season is almost over.

Vic Sage Sep 27 2007 11:01 AM

="Johnny Dickshot"] ="soupcan"]Um, fellas? The offense ain't the problem. Sure it is... in a way. Reyes is going as badly as he ever has in his career*, we seemingly can't stop making ill-advised baserunning dares**, we tend to have too many innings where we go down too easily***, we too often fail to execute the basics (get the guy over, score him from 2nd, etc etc) and as long as we know the pitching is a complete crapshoot we have to assume also that the O isn't good enough enough till we score 7 or 8 a night. *-Apparently he took xtra BP with Hojo prior to yesterday's 2HR performance... **-We damn near lost a third game in a month as the result of getting caught stealing 3rd with 2 outs. How is that offense that does that not a problem? ***-13, 9 and 11 pitch innings last night. no, the offense is NOT the problem, JD. Lets look at the stats during this slide The first 10 days of September, the Mets went 8-1, scoring 47 runs for an average of 5+ runs per game. On 9/11, El Duque got hurt while getting slammed by Atlanta 13-5, and the Mets have been in free fall since, going 5-10 during these last 2 weeks. The offense during that period, however, has continued to score, with 89 runs during this 15 game skid, for an average of just under 6 runs per game. So clearly, the difference between the 8-1 Mets of early september and the 5-10 Mets of the last 2 weeks is not about offense. The mets have scored 5 or more runs in 10 of the last 15 games. Even during the 10 losses, the Mets scored 49 runs, just a smidgen under 5 runs a game. Certainly, the O has failed in certain situations over this period, but blaming them, to even the slightest degree, for not scoring more than 6 runs a game seems really bizarre to me. Meanwhile, the defense has given up 113 runs over this period, nearly 7.5 runs a game. And you want to talk about Reyes?

Johnny Dickshot Sep 27 2007 11:15 AM

I give up

Nymr83 Sep 27 2007 11:29 AM

you should give up, because the pitxching is clearly the problem, telling the offense "hey guys, your pitchers suck so i expect you to score 10 runs a game" isnt fair.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 27 2007 11:30 AM

I don;t recall saying it was fair.

Edgy DC Sep 27 2007 11:39 AM

Nor did I. I just know we're at the time of year that nobody can look to anybody but themselves. And I hoped the batters could pull this shit off, as the pitching is falling like a house of cards. If and when Pedro leaves the game tonight, he should walk right to the bullpen and coach those suckers up.

Nymr83 Sep 27 2007 12:27 PM

maybe Pedro should just try not to leave at all tonight. can the starters stop going 4 1/3 or 5 2/3 every night?

HahnSolo Sep 27 2007 12:47 PM

The offense shares the blame for last night, imo. The Mets scored 6 runs in the first four innings, then when their opponent counterpunched, they did nothing, nada, zip, the last five innings. As bad as the 5th was, Schoenweis, Duque, and Heilman kept it a 1-run game for 3 innings, and the offense did not capitalize.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 27 2007 12:51 PM

They went down on 6 pitches in the 8th (and 11 in the 9th) but let's pretend it didn't happen. They had only 2 baserunners, both on infield singles, in the final 5 innings.

Vic Sage Sep 27 2007 01:01 PM

The Mets scored 6 runs last night. Whether they scored in the 1st or the 9th should be immaterial. putting up 6 runs should be enough for a major league pitching staff to get a win. That the pitchers couldn't make that stand up is on THEM, not the hitters.

Benjamin Grimm Sep 27 2007 01:01 PM

I'd love to think that they just match up poorly against Washington and Philadelphia. If that were true, they could potentially romp to the World Series from this point forward without facing either team again. During that series at RFK they looked so obviously tight. It was most noticeable in the field. Every time they picked up a ball I felt like they were going to throw it wildly. (And they often did.) Now the tightness is more subtle. They come into a game like gangbusters and score early. Then once they fall behind, the life goes out of them. They've been playing like they're afraid to lose and it's making them lose. Maybe they'll have better mojo against the Cardinals and Marlins. It's a slim hope to hang our hat on, but it is what it is.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 27 2007 01:15 PM

Vic Sage wrote: The Mets scored 6 runs last night. Whether they scored in the 1st or the 9th should be immaterial. putting up 6 runs should be enough for a major league pitching staff to get a win. That the pitchers couldn't make that stand up is on THEM, not the hitters. It should be immaterial except it isn't. Whether they scored 6 runs or 0 they still fell a run short. Nowhere am I intimating the pitchers don't suck a great deal more bhmc than the hitters. Or that 6 runs ought to be enough to win. It should. I'm saying that shitty pitching being the case, the hitters need to do more in order to win. That means, they can't go 5 innings without scoring. (I am also saying that poor innings and poor execution tend to have been an isssue with this offense whether they score 6, 3 or 0 runs in a game).

Mendoza Line Sep 27 2007 01:17 PM

Vic Sage wrote: That the pitchers couldn't make that stand up is on THEM, not the hitters. True that. Still, there are specific changes that would improve the offense and get us more runs (take more pitches, be careful when taking a big lead off first, don't attempt to steal third with two out). Is there anything specific that would improve the pitching, other than having them suck less? As a baseball fan, I'd like to see the pitching improve so that we can have some nice, well-played, 2-1 games for a change. As a Mets fan, I don't care whether the Mets win 2-1 or 12-11, as long as the Mets win. If the offense can squeeze out more runs, that's just as good as the pitching giving up fewer runs.

smg58 Sep 27 2007 02:24 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I'd love to think that they just match up poorly against Washington and Philadelphia. I'd love to think that they match up perfectly well against Philly and that the laws of probability dictate that a four-game squasher in our favor is in order should we meet up again. But let's get there first.

cooby Sep 27 2007 08:23 PM

Okay. Tomorrow is the last working day (for me at least) of the regular season. I'm already going to get some good natured ribbing so I might as well show my colors. It's the Mets orange hoodie for me. Maybe with the Bernie shirt under for luck. Can't hurt.

cooby Sep 28 2007 04:57 PM

Got the expected reaction but I told Jason he'd be wearing this orange hoodie come Monday when I have bragging rights.