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J-E-T-S, JETS, JETS, JETS

Elster88 Aug 08 2005 04:39 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 22 2005 01:15 PM

9/11 1:00 at Kansas City 9/18 4:15 Miami 9/25 1:00 Jacksonville 10/2 4:05 at Baltimore 10/9 1:00 Tampa Bay 10/16 4:15 at Buffalo 10/24 9:00 at Atlanta (Monday night) 10/30 bye 11/6 1:00 San Diego 11/13 4:05 at Carolina 11/20 4:15 at Denver 11/27 8:30 New Orleans (Sunday night) 12/4 4:15 at New England 12/11 1:00 Oakland 12/18 1:00 at Miami 12/26 9:00 New England (Monday night) 1/1 1:00 Buffalo First thoughts 3 night time national games is always fun. NFC rivalry is the South, two of those games are night games. Games on New Year's Day provides a nice alternative because I don't watch college football No advantage of having Miami visiting during the cold months this year. Having the bye week almost right in the middle of the year (after the seventh game) is nice. End the season with all three division rivals.

KC Aug 08 2005 06:01 PM

Of course today they also finalized the Ty Law announcement that he is now a very rich man. He's a special player, but I have mixed feelings about long time divisional rivals coming over to the green side for some reason especially ones coming off injuries. Mickens is released ending a long Jets career unless he ends up back some how with the these things sometimes work in football.

Vic Sage Aug 09 2005 02:50 PM

me likey. that monday night game the day after christmas against the Pats should be a hummmmmdinger!

Elster88 Aug 17 2005 10:22 AM

Heard a couple of interviews on M&MD yesterday. Vilma came off as very intelligent, using (correctly!) the word epitome. He threw in some of the usual jock-speak, but sounded like a good speaker (and not just for a football player). Of course, this thought was passing through my head moments before Francessa said the same thing, so I question myself now. If this kid Nugent does anything less than make five 50-yard field goals in the week one I'm going to be sorely disappointed. I am pleased that Ty Law is on the team. Can football start now please?

Willets Point Aug 17 2005 10:34 AM

Elster88 wrote: Can football start now please? No, it's baseball season.

metirish Aug 17 2005 10:47 AM

I have the NFL Network,(it's free), lots of pre-season games over the weekend. This could be a big year for the Jets, the offensive coordinator Mike Heimerdinger was on with M&MD yesterday and was a decent interview.

MFS62 Aug 17 2005 10:51 AM

Elster88 wrote: If this kid Nugent does anything less than make five 50-yard field goals in the week one I'm going to be sorely disappointed. I'd rather he be 1-1 in FG attempts and 6-6 in extra points. Later

Elster88 Aug 17 2005 11:02 AM

Willets Point wrote: ="Elster88"] Can football start now please? No, it's baseball season. It's possible to have both. :-)

Frayed Knot Aug 17 2005 11:33 AM

Y'know that schedule's fine ... unless you happen to be a ticket holder that is. The conundrum for fans about NFL schedules is that the better your team is - or is projected to be - the more 4:00 and prime-time games you'll get. And, while October/November (and even December in many cases) afternoons can be quite pleasant in the north-east, night games can bring nasty temps to sit through and 4PM games are essentially night games at that time of year. But the NFL has long treated it's stadiums as if merely gigantic TV studios. It's the TV customer (read: network) they care about, not the paying ones. They've already delayed the season for a week because the TV ratings weren't big enough during Labor Day weekend (damn family vacations and all) and there's talk about pushing it back several more weeks in an attempt to take advantage of the otherwise empty TV time in February. These aren't games so much as they're 'programming' and who needs Sept/Oct time-slots when you can have Jan/Feb?

Elster88 Aug 17 2005 11:57 AM

I've been to three pro football games in my life and have not had fun so far.

KC Aug 17 2005 02:00 PM

I love going to Jets' games -- the cold ones, the wet ones (well, my seats are covered), the hot ones -- this will be my 16th season. God, I'm getting fucking old already. The home schedule does blow this year. 4 o'clockers and night games are a pain in the ass, but we'll manage. Anyone wants to tailgate, we usually have about ten people -- parking lot coordinates available by PM request lol.

Johnny Dickshot Aug 17 2005 02:06 PM

How about a cpf j-e-t-s pig roast. All I need a someone with a truck and a ticket to the game. I will provide pig-cooking apparatus and a pig.

KC Aug 17 2005 02:16 PM

You get a pig to The Meadowlands parking lot and I have two seats for ya if the wife wants to come too or whoever. Any game but opening day, that one's already booked and planned. How long did it take to cook that pig at your place?

seawolf17 Aug 17 2005 02:17 PM

Pick the day, we're there.

Willets Point Aug 17 2005 02:29 PM

Football should start the first weekend after Nov. 1st, play 2 games a week (one on the weekend, one on Wednesday nights, no more of this once a week wusiness) and finish up the regular season around New Year's Eve.

KC Aug 17 2005 02:35 PM

Not that mine is any less silly, but it's hard to take you seriously with that avatar lolol. You forgot, "and lose the pads, helmets, and cortisone shots".

ScarletKnight41 Aug 17 2005 02:52 PM

My boys LOVE Willets' avatar. I'll try to be there for the big roast game - sounds like fun!

Willets Point Aug 17 2005 02:53 PM

I have some other crazy ideas on how to make football more interesting to me. Football types always go on about how the sport is fast-paced and action-packed. Really? How many games are pock-marked with timeouts, commercial breaks and penalty replays? How many times do we see a five-minute commercial break, a kickoff, and then another five-minute commercial break? I'd make football like soccer, for each 15-minute quarter the clock never stops for anything. That would be fast-paced and action-packed. Football types also go on about football being high-scoring. Of course they rarely mention that touchdowns are 6 points with an almost guaranteed 1 point after toudhdown, while almost every other sport you get 1 point per score. How 'bout 3 points for touchdown, 2 for a safety, and 1 for a field goal and get rid of the weeny pat's and 2-point conversions. I don't expect anyone to take me seriously, but as I said this would make the sport more interesting to me. The NFL gets a lot of hype for a lot of boredom imho.

KC Aug 17 2005 03:14 PM

I have a friend who calls football - footbore. I enjoy going much more than watching on tv and we usually turn it in to an all day event. Anyways, let's get cpfr's to chime in if there's any interest in this - we have plenty of time - but if there are people who want to try and get tickets we shouldn't wait too long. The Jets are gonna be hot this year, especially if they get a couple under their belts and live up to the billing.

Vic Sage Aug 17 2005 03:20 PM

i would absolutely love to go to a 1pm game, but i've got no connections for Jets tix. my preferred games: 9/25 1:00 Jacksonville 10/9 1:00 Tampa Bay 12/11 1:00 Oakland

KC Aug 17 2005 03:38 PM

Good idea, anyone interested chime in with two or three dates that they'd be willing to meet and we can whittle down and see what we're looking at. Between stubhub, ebay, and a couple of people I might be able to buy some seats from it's pretty easy to get tickets once we decide on a date. We also need to get Dickshot and guest and critter and the critter oven to NJ. That would be an insane triangle from where I'm coming from and going.

seawolf17 Aug 17 2005 03:39 PM

Any date is fine by me; I won't need tickets, as a friend (the MFY fan mentioned in another thread and met by some earlier this season) has season seats this year and told me to pick any game and we'll go.

GYC Aug 17 2005 10:29 PM

Don't know if ya'll listened/watched Fatcessa & The Dumb Dog but Russo challenged Hendu & got destroyed. http://s23.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0DG5112NF2GAB0YYA1V61X1VY7

Johnny Dickshot Aug 17 2005 10:55 PM

With some advance notice we can prolly borrow the M-i-L's truck. The pig took ~3 hours, so a 4 p.m.-er might be best for tailgating purposes ... How early do they let you in?

KC Aug 18 2005 07:55 AM

>>>How early do they let you in?<<< I think some people start filling in on Saturday and stay over. We're good for any game. If it's an early one I don't mind meeting super early and helping getting the critter going. We'll give it a week or so for people to chime in and open this thread a couple of times. J E T S JETS JETS JETS

Elster88 Aug 18 2005 10:42 AM

]Nugent's Ohio State teammates unanimously elected him a team captain, which really sold special teams coach Mike Westhoff on him. I'm guessing this is unusual.

OlerudOwned Aug 18 2005 08:16 PM

Elster88 wrote: ]Nugent's Ohio State teammates unanimously elected him a team captain, which really sold special teams coach Mike Westhoff on him. I'm guessing this is unusual. Thats Ohio State for ya, a bunch of ass backwards clowns

SI Metman Aug 20 2005 03:58 PM

Soooo.. is Chad back? His first two drives scared me, but his third drive was a thing of beauty.

ScarletKnight41 Aug 20 2005 04:14 PM

We sold our Jacksonville tickets, so let's not have the pig roast that day (Sept. 15).

KC Aug 20 2005 04:47 PM

Pig logistics prolly should dictate a four o'clocker. I nominate that first Sunday in November against thah Chahrgers. It will be a little cooler, that pig thing throws off some serious heat. We should pick a date before the season starts, to give people who need tickets time to do so.

KC Aug 21 2005 10:47 AM

Apparently, the 11/6 4:15 San Diego listed on page one should read 1:00. Good catch by Mrs. Fields. Crap.

metirish Aug 22 2005 11:29 AM

Why don't the Jets have cheerleaders?, I was reading a Q&A with Vilma in Maxim and that was one of the questions.

Willets Point Aug 22 2005 12:56 PM

Too freakin' cold in E. Rutherford to dance about in tassles and skimpy shorts.

Elster88 Aug 22 2005 01:14 PM

KC wrote: Apparently, the 11/6 4:15 San Diego listed on page one should read 1:00. Good catch by Mrs. Fields. Crap. My bad. Fixed.

ScarletKnight41 Aug 24 2005 04:13 PM

We got our season ticketholder cap today. This year it's khaki colored with green lettering. It's hard to contain my excitement. OTOH, it beats a poke in the eye with a sharp stick.

KC Aug 24 2005 04:20 PM

I hope they embroider the right section on mine this year (lo f'n l)

Elster88 Aug 30 2005 11:14 AM

John Abraham signed for this year. I'm really looking forward to next Sunday. I haven't had to flip between a Jet game and a Met game in a long time. I'm a master with the remote. _____________________________ This post was made under the posting designation 170) Barry Lyons

Elster88 Sep 06 2005 09:45 AM

One week to go. _____________________________ This post was made under the designation 163) Charlie Neal

metirish Sep 06 2005 09:52 AM

OK I'm a Jets fan, but not a nut, but I know enough about them to get by, for the more knowledgeable fan here, what kind of pressure is Herm under this year, a lot of coaches have been fired the past few years under him, is he on the hot seat this season?

SI Metman Sep 06 2005 12:44 PM

I doubt Herm is on the hot seat unless this team goes 6-10. He's gotten us to the playoffs the last few years, and this team has the talent to go there again. Oh and commenting on Willets cheerleaders comment from a few weeks ago - They have them in both Foxboro and Philly. Does the Meadowlands have some sort of anti-Cheerleader policy?

Elster88 Sep 06 2005 12:48 PM

SI Metman wrote: I doubt Herm is on the hot seat unless this team goes 6-10. He's gotten us to the playoffs the last few years, and this team has the talent to go there again. Sadly, I agree. I am not a fan of the Herm. We are wasting these years with this core with him at head coach. _____________________________ This post was made under the designation 163) Charlie Neal

SI Metman Sep 06 2005 12:51 PM

Elster88 wrote: ="SI Metman"]I doubt Herm is on the hot seat unless this team goes 6-10. He's gotten us to the playoffs the last few years, and this team has the talent to go there again. Sadly, I agree. I am not a fan of the Herm. We are wasting these years with this core with him at head coach. _____________________________ This post was made under the designation 163) Charlie Neal We aren't wasting these years, we are just the victims of bad timing, ala the Knicks in the 90's who couldn't get past some guy from Chicago. The Jets would be running off division title after division title if it weren't for that juggernaut in New England.

Elster88 Sep 06 2005 02:12 PM

New England has never knocked us out of the playoffs. You cannot go all the way with a coach who can't manage the clock. It is not possible. Bad analogy anyway. The Knicks should've won in '94, which also had nothing to do with the Bulls. _____________________________ This post was made under the designation 163) Charlie Neal

ScarletKnight41 Sep 06 2005 02:15 PM

So when are we roasting that pig?

MFS62 Sep 11 2005 04:16 PM

That was fucking ugly. Later

KC Sep 11 2005 04:17 PM

We should talk about the pig this week, if we're going to do it. Today's game went halfway the way I thought it would. I expected a shootout with the Chiefs winning. I picked them in the year long pool I'm in. Jets didn't hold up their end at all on offense. Punting game looked good. So did the fum- bling game. We'll see how it pans out over a season, but Priest really doesn't deserve a back-up that may be better than him ... dude is a huge and scary looking back.

Elster88 Sep 12 2005 09:36 AM

Ugh, what a mess that was. I waited a long time for Week 1, and that was not fun to watch. I hat waiting a week between games.

seawolf17 Sep 12 2005 09:45 AM

Since we're talking pig, again, I'm up for just about whenever. Are we still thinking about that November 6 game?

Elster88 Sep 12 2005 09:53 AM

"I wish we could have made more of a game of it, but it wasn't," said Jets coach Herman Edwards. "They took us behind the woodshed and whupped us." _____________________________ This post had the designation 158) Mark Carreon

ScarletKnight41 Sep 12 2005 10:01 AM

Just decide soon, before D-Dad offers to take someone else to the game.

KC Sep 12 2005 10:03 AM

I think we need to pick a four o'clock game. Cooking, devouring, packing leftovers, and cleaning will take some time. Is there something else a little smaller that we can make in the box? Wonder how Chad's head feels this morning, I know I still have a headache.

seawolf17 Sep 12 2005 10:15 AM

We have no more 4s, unless you count this weekend. If we want to try to hit the Sunday night ESPN game on Thanksgiving weekend...

ScarletKnight41 Sep 13 2005 04:10 PM

Let's not roast the pig Oct 9. That weekend is shaping up to be a bad one.

Elster88 Sep 13 2005 04:15 PM

Everybody and their mother is doing the "Are the Jets really bad or was it just a hiccup?" routine. I've forgotten how annoying midweek sportstalk can be after your football team got thrashed. _____________________________ This was Elster88's last post with the designation 157) Alex Ochoa. Goodbye to a five-tooler who only had one tool.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 13 2005 04:42 PM

We can do like, 3-5 turkeys at once in the box at a hour and a half a pop. That's appropriate for a 1 p.m. game, if we arrive early enough, and easier on the re$ources & cleanup.

KC Sep 13 2005 05:37 PM

Ok, cool. Everyone interested please chime in on 11/6 vs.Chargers or the 12/11 game against the Raiders. If we don't summon enough interest, JD, you're still invited to the game you voted and we'll just cook for you instead. Since we're all procrastinators, we'll set the vote to end on 9/20! On edit, I forgot to vote: 12/11 vs. Traitors

ScarletKnight41 Sep 13 2005 07:47 PM

D-Dad would prefer the November date, but we're free for either of them. Just let us know so that we keep both tix for ourselves.

seawolf17 Sep 13 2005 07:57 PM

I'll take either date also, but prefer November.

KC Sep 13 2005 08:03 PM

>>>Just let us know so that we keep both tix for ourselves.<<< If we wanted to keep it from you we'd do it by email ... again. *snicker*

ScarletKnight41 Sep 13 2005 08:52 PM

<pout>

Johnny Dickshot Sep 13 2005 10:45 PM

We're OK for either date.

KC Sep 14 2005 09:46 AM

Upon further review, I change my vote to the October date. Still first down.

Vic Sage Sep 14 2005 02:54 PM

november for me

Elster88 Sep 18 2005 04:58 PM

Pennington looks terrible today. The one long pass that he completed was a lob. It looked exactly like a thirty yard hail mary. One announcer said he is still trying to learn to throw with both velocity and accuracy. Which is a load of crap. It's pretty obvious that he just can't throw right now. Not that he had a strong arm to begin with, but I think the shoulder is still having an effect. ____________________________ This post had the designation 151) Glendon Rusch

Elster88 Sep 18 2005 05:14 PM

I love how they keep showing Herman Edwards' keys to winning like it's rocket science. 1) Run the ball / Stop the Run 2) Protect the ball / Take it away 3) No foolish penalties / Good special teams Apparently the one that didn't make the cut is Score more points than the other team / Hold the opposition to less points than you score. ____________________________ This post had the designation 151) Glendon Rusch

Elster88 Sep 19 2005 02:48 PM

]News Curtis Martin suffered an apparent right knee injury during Sunday's win over the Dolphins. Head coach Herm Edwards refused to speculate as to how serious the injury is, but he said in his Monday afternoon press conference that Martin will undergo an MRI on Monday, after which the team will know more about his status. Not good. _____________________________ This was Elster88's last post with the designation 151) Glendon Rusch

metirish Sep 19 2005 02:53 PM

Next weeks game figures to be tough one, the Jaguars defence is great, another low scoring game no doubt.

metirish Sep 19 2005 03:01 PM

Coles reveals he was sexually abused http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/4884578 WOW..

Elster88 Sep 21 2005 09:55 AM

Curtis Martin's MRI came back negative. He will start on Sunday. _____________________________ This post had the designation 148) George Stone

ScarletKnight41 Sep 21 2005 02:37 PM

When are we having the pig roast?

Elster88 Sep 21 2005 03:37 PM

Can we talk more pigskin and less pig in this thread? Or am I the only one who actually likes football? _____________________________ This post had the designation 148) George Stone

metirish Sep 21 2005 03:55 PM

Martin is tough out, the last game he missed was in 1998 and in 11 years he has missed only 4 games.....

KC Sep 21 2005 03:56 PM

It changed to turkeys, and I think November wins unless Mr. Dickshot can't make it. Let's all plan on that November 'gainst the Chargers game. I'll start an email circle in the next couple of days and keep this out of everyone's faces. Good news about My Favorite Martin. Between Chad's recovery and Curtis' aging bod - I'm afraid that stufff like this may be a weekly oc- curance.

ScarletKnight41 Sep 21 2005 03:57 PM

November it is :)

seawolf17 Sep 21 2005 08:48 PM

I am not confident at all in this team. Chad's injury scares me, Curtis is old, the defense seems overrated, and as good as Coles was two years ago, that was... well, two years ago.

KC Sep 23 2005 09:23 PM

I may have two tickets for this Sun the 25th, subject to waiting for phone calls and stuff. Lower level, Sec 127. I'd have to meet youse at the game, preferably early, near where I park. Face is $140, I'd probably take a little less if you bought me an overpriced beer at halftime. PM if interested, no emails.

KC Sep 25 2005 09:14 PM

Last post about the Nov CPF game, I promise. I sent out an email, if anyone who was interested didn't get it, please PM me and I'll add you to the loop. And yes, we stayed until the bitter end today and I don't want to talk about it.

metirish Sep 26 2005 08:46 PM

Looks like Chad's season is done, the MRI showed a torn rotator cuff, a visit to Dr. Andrews is the plan, we'll know tomorrow about Jay Fielder, but that's not looking good either, Brooks Bollinger to start Sunday, any chance the Jets bring back Testerverde?

SI Metman Sep 26 2005 08:51 PM

Fiedler is reportedly out 6 weeks. The Jets are scrambing for a QB. It's 1999 all over again.

Elster88 Sep 27 2005 10:34 AM

Where's Tom Tupa when you need him? _____________________________ This post had the designation 145) Cal Koonce

metirish Sep 27 2005 10:53 AM

From the Daily News... ]A trio of journeymen will audition today for team officials. According to sources, the three candidates are former Giants backup Jesse (the Bachelor) Palmer, Doug Johnson (cut last week by the Browns) and Jonathan Quinn (cut recently by the Chiefs). ouch...yikes..fuck..

Frayed Knot Sep 27 2005 11:00 AM

Newsday.com is reporting that the Jets have signed ... Vinny Testaverde.

Elster88 Sep 27 2005 11:33 AM

YES!!!! VIN-NY! VIN-NY! VIN-NY! VIN-NY! VIN-NY! VIN-NY! SUPERBOWL HERE WE COME!!!!

Elster88 Sep 27 2005 11:58 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 27 2005 12:02 PM

metirish Sep 27 2005 12:01 PM

He's old but I would rather take my chances with Vinnie than the others mentioned, Vinnie can still throw the ball, welcome back old friend.

Elster88 Sep 27 2005 12:04 PM

I'll tell you one thing, you can't stack the line against him. He can still throw the ball a country mile. Now I wish we had Moss back. Pennington couldn't make use of his speed because he couldn't throw the ball deep. Just how long is a country mile anyway? I have an unhealthy man-crush on him. He's the football version of Piazza for me. An Italian who brought my team back to respectability in the late nineties. Though in Vinny's case he wasn't the only guy or even the main guy who did so. _____________________________ This post had the designation 145) Cal Koonce

Elster88 Sep 27 2005 02:58 PM

From the press conference: Bollinger is the starter. Herm was adamant. When someone mentioned Vinny managing the game in end-game situations, Herm went so far as to correct him, saying "Well, Brooks will be managing those situations because he's the starter." Herm is very good in press conferences. He noted that some of the players who have joined the team since Vinny left only know Vinny from the Madden games. (chuckes from the crowd) "And that's the first Madden game." (louder chuckles) When someone asked if Vinny will be able to pick up the offense: "Vinny's seen pretty much every offense in the National Football League. There are probably some named after him." I've said it before: Herm is the best coach you can have from Monday to Saturday. I just want someone else running things during the game. Apparently, Vinny called Herm first. Herm said he was going to call eventually, it was "just a matter of who called who first." When he picked up the phone, he said he and Vinny both laughed and he asked what took so long for Vinny to call. I'm officially hyped. I hope Vinny gets in by halftime. I realize he's in his forties and can hardly move, but I had already given up on this season when I heard Fiedler was out for ten weeks. Now I'm just excited to see Vinny on the field again. And regardless of my own biases, there's a reason Bollinger has been tabbed as a third string quarterback, and that the guy Parcells cut last year (to start Vinny, I might add) was ahead of him on the depth chart last year. _____________________________ This post had the designation 145) Cal Koonce

metirish Sep 27 2005 03:51 PM

Yeah I'm excited too, I just hope Vinnie has something left,it's a lot to ask for him to save our season but I'll take my chances with him.Good evaluation of Herm, he's king of the press conference and useless during the game.

SI Metman Sep 27 2005 06:46 PM

So Bollinger is still the starter on Sunday. I say Vinny is in there by the third series.

metirish Sep 28 2005 09:31 AM

I love this bit being reported... ]Vinny Testaverde was getting reacquainted with his surroundings at Weeb Ewbank Hall yesterday when he was introduced to his new quarterbacks coach, Jeremy Bates. Testaverde, 41, immediately realized that he knew Bates, 29, who was a teenage ball boy in Cleveland when Testaverde was there in the early '90s. that's just weird...LOL

Elster88 Sep 29 2005 09:15 AM

Pennington may not be out for the season, but Herm refuses to speak about it.

Elster88 Oct 03 2005 01:54 PM

Ugh. Bollinger was adequate. Coles and McCareins have been dropping passes. Hard to get Curtis going when Baltimore is lining up in the 7-4-0.

metirish Oct 03 2005 01:57 PM

Tough game to watch,I guess Bollinger did what he was asked to do, mainly don't throw a bunch of interceptions.

seawolf17 Oct 03 2005 05:50 PM

This team blows right now. I wouldn't be surprised if they don't find the end zone the rest of the year. edit: Okay, I would be VERY surprised if that actually happened. You know what I mean.

GYC Oct 03 2005 09:21 PM

Time for Herm to find a new team...

Elster88 Oct 05 2005 01:28 PM

Vinny confirmed as the week 5 starter.

MFS62 Oct 09 2005 04:43 PM

And they squeak out a win. That was gut-wrenching. But a win is a win. Later

Elster88 Oct 10 2005 09:51 AM

They tried their best to give this game away. Two missed field goals, one of which should've gone in. I'll give a pass to the kid on the 48-yarder. A fumbled punt led to a Tampa field goal. Herm calling timeout in the waning minutes of the first half when the other team has the ball (which he has done for the past few games) led to a Tampa field goal with 8 seconds left. An interception was overturned because of a late hit. Led to a Tampa field goal. (Another interception was overturned because of a penalty, but that time the only reason the pass was picked was because the Jet DB basically tackled the Tampa receiver while the ball was in the air.) Vinny doing the thing that makes people say "Well, Vinny's Vinny." (throwing the ball up for grabs rather than taking the sack), which I knew was an interception as the ball left his hand, led to another Tampa field goal. Strangely, the picture of that play, which I've attached, is the one the Times chose to run. But I'll count that one, too, because that's going to happen with Vinny. So by my count the score should've been more like 17-6. I thought I was the only one with a soft spot for Vinny, but the crowd went a little nuts when he took the field for the first Jet drive. Did anyone go to this game? How was it?

Elster88 Oct 10 2005 10:40 AM

]Another time, Testaverde botched a call in the huddle. It was greeted by quizzical looks. So he improvised. "Everybody looked at me like, 'What are you trying to call?' Testaverde said. "I told them, 'You run a hook, you run a seam.' Just like doing it in the dirt." I love it.

PiazzaFan411 Oct 10 2005 07:27 PM

If Vinnie is starting next week he should make short work of the shitty Buffalo defense. I live in Buffalo but i personally HATE the Buffale Bills. I HATE their coach and I HATE Losman. Screw the Bills, GO JETS!

Elster88 Oct 17 2005 10:15 AM

The Jets lost to the Bills.

metirish Oct 17 2005 10:37 PM

Kevin Mawae is out for the season with a a torn triceps tendon in his left arm, you know this is the one guy you didn't want to lose after al that has happened, a season that had great expectations has turned to shit..

Elster88 Oct 26 2005 03:57 PM

Shit. Dammit. Crap. FUCK.

KC Oct 26 2005 04:16 PM

I take it there's more bad news?

Elster88 Oct 26 2005 04:18 PM

At least they can't lose this weekend.

metirish Oct 26 2005 04:21 PM

Wouldn't it just be better to lose all you can and hope for Matt Leinart in the draft, at the least get a high pick.

HahnSolo Oct 26 2005 04:58 PM

As far as getting a high draft pick with Leinart, be careful what you wish for...since 1977, the Jets have drafted in the top five 8 times. Here's what they got for their troubles: 1977, Marvin Powell, #4 1978, Chris Ward, #4 1980, Lam Jones, #2 1981, Freeman McNeil, #3 1990, Blair Thomas, #2 1993, Marvin Jones, #3 1996, Keyshawn Johnson, #1 2003, Dewayne Robertson, #4 Of those 8, two were total busts (Lam Jones and Thomas), three were I guess okay but their careers did not come close to what was expected (Powell, Ward, Marvin Jones), one was good and showed flashes of greatness (Keyshawn, whom they've never quite replaced), one was an all-time Jet (McNeil), and the jury is out on Robertson (although it is his third year and I don't exactly see opposing offensive coordinators game-planning around him). So losing games to guarantee a high pick guarantees you nothing.

MFS62 Oct 26 2005 05:33 PM

With all those non-winning seasons, its astounding that they've only been one of the worst 8 teams that few times. I guess in the NFL, being mediocre hurts you more than being bad. Curious, how many times did they have a top 8 pick and traded down? Later

HahnSolo Oct 27 2005 09:03 AM

I was pointing out only top five picks. I think they've had a few others that were in the top 8. Dave Cadigan comes to mind, but I'm not certain about that one. The only time I can remember that they traded down, without looking it up, would have been '97, Parcells' first draft. They had the #1 pick, but Peyton Manning stayed at Tennessee for his final year. They traded down with I think the Rams, who chose Orlando Pace at #1. I don't know how many total picks they got for the #1, but they picked James Farrior later in the first round.

Elster88 Oct 27 2005 09:09 AM

Robertson is an above average defensive back. Keyshawn was replaced with Coles, who is a better receiver. Moss would've been better utilized by a QB with a stronger arm. The Jets have about the same proportion of bust first round picks to contributors that the rest of the NFL has.

Vic Sage Oct 27 2005 12:00 PM

]Of those 8, two were total busts (Lam Jones and Thomas), three were I guess okay but their careers did not come close to what was expected (Powell, Ward, Marvin Jones), one was good and showed flashes of greatness (Keyshawn, whom they've never quite replaced), one was an all-time Jet (McNeil), and the jury is out on Robertson (although it is his third year and I don't exactly see opposing offensive coordinators game-planning around him). 1 - Thomas was, indeed, the all-time Jets bust; Lam Jones was disappointing and a relative bust, but did have some productive years opposite Wesley Walker; 2 - Marvin Powell and Marvin Jones were career Jets who were excellent players. You can't really expect more than that from a draft pick. Ward's career slid more quickly, but was a decent player; 3 - Keyshawn WAS great in NY, and when we traded him, we got picks that turned into John Abraham and Chad Pennington. I'd say that pick worked out pretty darn well; 4 - McNeil was indeed an all-time great Jet, and 5- the jury is NOT out on Robertson. After an unproductive rookie season, he had an all-pro quality season last year and, despite a cast on his hand, he's played well this year, too. I'd say the Jets have had a pretty good history with their high picks, or at least no worse than most other teams.

HahnSolo Oct 27 2005 12:20 PM

Vic, maybe I sounded a little more down on Robertson than I should have. He's clearly better now than when he came into the league, and Vilma has certainly benefitted from his presence up front. This started with Metirish's question about losing as much as possible to get a high pick. Putting aside the fact that teams just don't go and lose on purpose (the Pittsburgh Penguins when Lemieux was the #1 pick being an exception), I was just demonstrating that high picks are nothing to count on. And you and Elster are right about other teams' drafts, so maybe I was a little unfair to single out the Jets. For instance, we could have the Bengals draft history: (year, draft position, player) 1984, 7, Ricky Hunley 1988, 5, Ricky Dixon 1992, 5, David Klingler 1993, 5, John Copeland 1994, 1, Dan Wilkinson 1995, 1, KiJana Carter 1999, 3, Akili Smith 2000, 4, Peter Warrick 2001, 4, Justin Smith 2003, 1, Carson Palmer Wow. Wow. At least Justin Smith and Palmer are good.

KC Oct 30 2005 01:46 PM

I lost my email of who all is going to the first annual CPF Jets game next week. Can we get a roll call of who's in by Mon or Tues at the latest and I'll re-start the email chain. If anyone who thought they couldn't go and maybe were on the fence by all mean look into getting some tickets and joining us in D13. Tickets are a lot easier to get now than they were a couple of weeks ago since the teams season is now in the toilet (again). Hopefully, it will be as nice a day as today weather wise. J E T S jets jets jets

SI Metman Oct 30 2005 01:56 PM

Well, the good thing is that the Jets won't be losing this weekend. The bad thing is that they won't be winning either.

seawolf17 Oct 30 2005 01:57 PM

We'll be there.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 30 2005 03:28 PM

I'm not sure what's up for that day. If you know of anyone with two extra tickets, that could be a solution. D-Dad will be there for sure, possibly with MK.

KC Oct 30 2005 03:45 PM

If getting tix is an option, just get them. Stubhub, etc ... there will be plenty of people with tix to dump on game day for less than face ... it's like a Jets' fan ritual when the season is craptacular. Otherwise, come tailgate and go home and beat the traffic lol.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 30 2005 03:54 PM

Yeah, I'll talk to D-Dad and we'll figure out what we're doing.

KC Oct 31 2005 05:59 PM

I sent out an email re: this, please everyone respond asap and let's get planning. Thx.

KC Nov 01 2005 09:35 PM

We've heard from everyone but seawolf ... he's not on his game today. (just crackin' nuts - answer your email)

PatchyFogg Nov 02 2005 01:28 PM

For those that are interested, here is the interview that we did with New York Post Jets beat writer Mark Cannizzaro on my 100% commercial-free, no one makes a dime from it, Sports Talk radio show last night. It's 19+ commercial-free minutes. http://hosted.filefront.com/patchyfogg Thanks, and I hope you enjoy.

KC Nov 02 2005 03:34 PM

Here I thought you were going to come tailgate.

Vic Sage Nov 04 2005 03:33 PM

D-E-A-D, DEAD DEAD DEAD!

KC Nov 04 2005 03:42 PM

Wuh? Ted Nugent finally has a big game as a Jet, Tomlinson leaves the game in the second quarter with a mysterious dehydration complication. Jets win 24-21 on a late 4th quarter FG. Bring canned goods, this Sunday is the annual food drive.

Elster88 Nov 06 2005 04:16 PM

I hate football.

Nymr83 Nov 06 2005 05:27 PM

disguting. the first time the offense was alive all year and the defense sure wasn't. it is definetaly time to turn the ball over to Bollinger, he's looked good at the end of the falcon game and this week, Testaverde hasn't looked good at all, and the season is essentially over so they might as well see what Bollinger can do in 8 games as the starter.

apmorris Nov 06 2005 07:33 PM

I concur. good play by jammer and bollinger on that last play : ; ; ; ; ; btw: am I the only one who thinks Schottenheimer and Edwards are related or maybe dropped from the same Jello® mold?

Frayed Knot Nov 07 2005 04:49 PM

Chrebet out for the season with yet another concussion. I'd have to think his career is over at this point, whether it's his choice or not.

Nymr83 Nov 07 2005 06:09 PM

i thought it was over after the last one. its time to hang up the spikes. Cotchery can fill in for the Jets and Wayne can go home and not risk getting killed.

KC Nov 07 2005 09:22 PM

Seeing the Chrebet catch and his helmet hitting concrete today was gut wrenching. He's always been that guy who will get that catch the team needed and didn't care how it got done. I hope he's smart enough to finally not try and come back next year ... prolly should have done so once or twice already. Kudos to JD, the turkey roaster, the boids turned out great. Always nice to have a little fun in the flesh with some CPFr's in person. We should really try to do a pig sometime in 2006 in the Shea parking lot and get a bigger turnout. Beavis: He said, "do a pig" Butthead: heh heh, yeh

Elster88 Nov 11 2005 02:32 PM

All right here we go. 8-0 in the second half means we end the year at 10-6 and win the AFC East. When I was in Vegas I put 100 on the Jets to make the Super Bowl to win 15,000. My buddy says I should've just taken the $100 bill and lit it on fire.

ScarletKnight41 Nov 13 2005 04:16 PM

I'm watching the game with D-Dad. We watch Bollinger get sacked. Me - That didn't look too good. DD - At least he didn't throw an interception. Me - THAT'S our new standard? DD - I think so.

seawolf17 Nov 13 2005 06:41 PM

Simple math: 4 INTs + 2 Fumbles = UGLY

ScarletKnight41 Nov 13 2005 07:55 PM

No, that equals FUGLY. Blech!

Willets Point Nov 13 2005 09:08 PM

I take it the Jets didn't win?

ScarletKnight41 Nov 13 2005 09:46 PM

You take it correctly.

metirish Nov 13 2005 10:54 PM

That interception with the Jets down 10 to 3 was just a killer, he fell aprt after that didn't he?...awful to watch.

Elster88 Nov 14 2005 09:04 AM

I hate football.

Elster88 Nov 21 2005 09:56 AM

I am now openly rooting for the Jets to lose to improve draft status.

metirish Nov 21 2005 10:12 AM

I said that weeks ago and got hammered for it.......Reggie Bush say hello to Jersey...

Elster88 Nov 21 2005 10:13 AM

Weeks ago I still believed in the possibility of the playoffs.

Nymr83 Nov 21 2005 10:25 AM

"Playoffs? you want to talk about playoffs?!?...."

metirish Nov 23 2005 11:15 AM

seawolf17 Nov 28 2005 09:23 AM

These Jets might be the worst team in the history of teams.

Elster88 Nov 28 2005 09:42 AM

Not even close.

Iubitul Nov 28 2005 10:04 AM

seawolf17 wrote: These Jets might be the worst team in the history of teams. The 1976 Bucs and the 1962 Mets are two that quickly come to mind...

Edgy DC Nov 28 2005 10:06 AM

Cleveland Spiders, kids.

metirish Nov 28 2005 10:07 AM

The Kotite Jets were a terrible team...

Vic Sage Nov 28 2005 11:46 AM

they're competing with the Saints for the #1 pick, so this was a good loss. Now we need David Carr to get Houston a few wins. Then, if Green Bay and SF start playing up to their venerable histories, we've got a shot at Reggie Bush.

Nymr83 Nov 28 2005 11:48 AM

i think SF or HOU will beat us to Bush, but last night's loss could help us land Leinart...lets face it folks, Pennington is scary.

Vic Sage Nov 28 2005 11:52 AM

Pennington may be scary, but i'm not sold on Leinhart. If we don't have the #1, i'd trade down, get multiple picks, and use them to try and get Rivers from SD.

MFS62 Dec 19 2005 01:29 PM

My wife and I have been invited to a wedding in Chicago next July. I just found out that the groom's best friend (and probable Best Man) is Sage Rosenfels. Yes, THAT Sage Rosenfels, the Dolphins' quarterback who threw the game winning touchdown pass against the Jets yesterday. Anyone have anything special I should say to him? Later

Willets Point Dec 19 2005 01:33 PM

Nice tux?

HahnSolo Dec 19 2005 02:11 PM

Do you have a sister named Rosemary, or a brother named Basil?

metirish Dec 19 2005 02:15 PM

MS62 - "So what NFL Europe team will you be playing for next year"

Frayed Knot Dec 19 2005 03:01 PM

Well, if you find yourself seated next to him at dinner you can always say; pass the parsley Sage, and could you give my friend Rosemary the time'.

MFS62 Dec 19 2005 03:07 PM

="Frayed Knot"]Well, if you find yourself seated next to him at dinner you can always say; pass the parsley Sage, and could you give my friend Rosemary the time'. When you were a child, you must have been abused by the Funkel brothers, Simon and Gar. Later

sharpie Dec 19 2005 03:09 PM

The 49ers and Houston play each other in the last game of the season in what will probably be the Bush Bowl.

Elster88 Dec 20 2005 04:59 PM

WOW. This surprises me. [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2265908]Link[/url] Alcohol sales banned for Jets-Patriots MNF (AP) HACKENSACK, N.J. -- Fears of rowdy fans during the holiday season have led officials to ban alcohol sales at next Monday night's game between the New York Jets and the New England Patriots at Giants Stadium. Jets spokesman Ron Colangelo said the ban was put in place to protect fans. "It's for the safety of our fans, so that they can have a comfortable environment at a time when the holiday season can get very festive," Colangelo told The Record of Bergen County for Tuesday's newspapers. The ban comes after a sometimes violent Nov. 27 Jets-Saints game in which police made nine arrests. In one altercation during the second half, two fans were stabbed outside a men's room. In another incident, a state trooper broke his leg while trying to eject a fan who reportedly threw a beer bottle. Earlier this year, New Jersey Sports and Exposition Authority president George Zoffinger pledged to deal with the problem of drunk fans. At the beginning of the year, a jury found the stadium beer vendor, Aramark, and a New York Giants fan liable for $135 million in damages in a case involving a 7-year-old girl who was paralyzed when the fan hit her family's car after leaving a game. The fan had purchased six beers at halftime even though he'd already drunk so much he was slurring his words.

KC Dec 20 2005 05:25 PM

I'm surprised they had beer on the Sunday night game. They haven't sold beer, so far as I can remember, at night games since at least 1990 when I started to go regularly. The legend is, there was a Mon- day night game against (I think) the Raiders in the 80's where there were near riots and dozens of fights and arrests so they put the beer sales on ice - eek, that was a bad play on words.

Elster88 Dec 20 2005 09:11 PM

KC wrote: I'm surprised they had beer on the Sunday night game. They haven't sold beer, so far as I can remember, at night games since at least 1990 when I started to go regularly. The legend is, there was a Mon- day night game against (I think) the Raiders in the 80's where there were near riots and dozens of fights and arrests so they put the beer sales on ice - eek, that was a bad play on words. I did not know this. You elitist season-ticket holder. Why don't you list your top ten attended games in your sig line? Not sure if I need to point out if I'm kidding or not. Just kidding.

KC Dec 20 2005 09:32 PM

'twould be easier to list the top ten most disappointing moments since 1990. My Jets' fandom is a lot different than my Mets. Going to the football games is more about getting together with a group and tailgaiting and bbbyyy for me. I don't lose sleep over the Jets - my baseball team on the other hand .... (and I know you're kidding - why do people think I have no sense of humor when I'm such an assclown?)

HahnSolo Dec 21 2005 09:20 AM

The game KC refers to was against the Bills, I'm guessing in either 88 or 89. Lowlighted by [small] fires being set in the upper deck, and in turn the fires being put out by folks peeing on them. Only ten disappointing moments to list since 1990. Let's see: -The Falcons pick Brett Favre one slot ahead of the Jets in the 1991 draft. The Jets get Browning Nagle with the next pick. Oh, and to add insult to injury, the Falcons trade Favre after just one season. -Blair Thomas's fumble while running out the clock at Soldier Field in 1991. His career tanked from there. -Boomer playing hurt in a loss to the Colts in 1993 that hurt playoff chances. He should have sat out. -The embarassing 24-0 loss to the Oilers and Bucky Richardson on the final day of the 1993 season, when a win would have put them in the playoffs. -Firing Coslet (that was okay) but keeping everybody else on the staff and front office, and elevating Carroll. -The fake spike game. The Jets blow a 18-point lead late in the third quarter where a win would have given them a share of first place. Started a season-ending 5-game losing streak. - Leon Hess: "I'm 80 years old. I want results now."...so here's Richie Kotite. -Bill Parcells deciding in the final game of 1997, with the playoffs on the line, to have Ray Lucas and Leon Johnson throwing critical passes. They were picked off, and the Jets lost to Wayne Fontes, Scott Mitchell, and the Lions. -The 98 AFC Championship Game, where no one could seemingly catch a punt, a kickoff, or hold on to the ball. -Game one, 1999. Vinny goes down with an achilles injury, and a season goes with him. Wow. There's ten, and I haven't even gotten past game one of the 1999 season. Some life, being a Jet fan.

Elster88 Dec 21 2005 11:20 AM

HahnSolo wrote: -The 98 AFC Championship Game, where no one could seemingly catch a punt, a kickoff, or hold on to the ball. 10-0 Jets at halftime. It's my fault. I was sure we had it won. Still a great year, and the Broncos were a pretty damn good team. Hard to call this a disappointment. Sure it sucks when you lose but that was a great ride for a Jet fan. And it gave me my second Italian sports hero. HahnSolo wrote: -Game one, 1999. Vinny goes down with an achilles injury, and a season goes with him. And a Super Bowl win. I mean, the fucking Titans almost won. One of the saddest days of my life. If the Jets had won it all that year Vinny woulda got the praise he deserves for his career.

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 12:22 PM

My pain is deeper. It goes back to the days when they were the New York Titans in the American Football League. My most gut wrnching Jets memory was in a game against the Raiders at Shea Stadium. The Jets were leading with a minute to go when George Blanda (replacing their starting QB) threw a 45+ yard Hail Mary pass that bounced off/ went through the arms of three Jet defenders and fell into the arms of Warren Wells, who was flat on his back in the end zone for the winning touchdown. I was listening to the game on the radio and punched a concrete column so hard that I chipped the stone on my College Ring. Later

Elster88 Dec 21 2005 04:56 PM

Ty Law, he of the 6 INTs and 25 pass interference penalties, is the only Jet to make the Pro Bowl. [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2267705]Roster[/url] [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2267706]NFC[/url]

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 09:47 PM

Elster88 wrote: Ty Law, he of the 6 INTs and 25 pass interference penalties, is the only Jet to make the Pro Bowl. [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2267705]Roster[/url] [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2267706]NFC[/url] Vilma got scrod. Later

HahnSolo Dec 23 2005 01:55 PM

A fond farewell to #80. He wore the uniform proudly (I think he's the last active Jet from the green-helmet era) for 11 seasons. Good bye and good luck Wayne.

Elster88 Dec 28 2005 04:24 PM

I HATE THE FUCKING RAIDERS. THEY ALWAYS FIND A WAY TO FUCK THINGS UP FOR THE JETS. So if Kerry Collins starts instead of Tuiosaosososososiuapououuuuouuuou, then the Jets might have lost, and would be 2-13 right now instead of 3-12. Then they would be tied with the Texans for the worst record, and, assuming a loss to the Bills next week, would lock up (at worst) the #2 pick in the draft. Instead, they are tied for the second worst record with 3 other teams (Green Bay, New Orleans, and San Francisco), and are currently slated to have the 4th pick next year. (If two teams have the same record, the tie is "broken" by opponents' total record. The combined record of all their opponents creates an opponent record, whoever has the worst opponent record gets priority in draft pick) ___________________________ Best case scenario: Green Bay and New Orleans win, Jets lose. If that happens the San Fran/Houston game actually has no bearing. Best case scenario with a Houston win: the Jets, Texans and Niners would all be 3-13 for the year. The opponent records and draft order after that would be: 1) Texans 128-113 2) Jets 129-112 3) 49ers 132-109 Best case scenario with a San Fran win: The Jets are the only 3-13 team, the Texans are 2-14: 1) Texans 2-14 2) Jets 3-13 3-tie) 49ers 4-12 ___________________________ A Jet loss combined with a Green Bay loss to Seattle (very likely, though if Seattle sits everyone, who knows) and a New Orleans loss to Tampa (very likely) and a Houston win results in [all teams 3-13]: 1) Saints 125-116 2 )Texans 128-113 3) Jets 129-112 4) Packers 131-110 5) 49ers 132-109 (If Houston loses in this scenario nothing changes except the Texans and Saints flip-flop and the Niners might drop below #5.) ___________________________ So, if the Jets had lost to the Raiders, they would have clinched the #2 pick with a loss to the Bills, and could have gotten the #1 pick if that was combined with a Houston win (extremely possible). If they had lost to the Raiders, the worst case scenario would be the #3 pick with a win against Buffalo and a New Orleans loss. ___________________________ Instead, a loss to Buffalo clinches the #3 pick, with the #2 only possible if New Orleans loses to Tampa (doubtful). And, of course, it gets even worse if the Jets win (possible). Then, if Houston beats San Fran and the other 3-12 teams lose, they could fall as far as the #6 pick because then Tennessee could come into the mix if they lose to Jacksonville to go 4-12 (opponent record 123-118). (If Oakland loses to the Giants, they would be 4-12 with an opponent record of 130-111, but would draft behind the Jets, whose oppenent record would drop to 128-113 if they beat Buffalo). 49ers, Packers, Texans, Saints 3-13 5) Titans 4-12, 123-118 6) Jets 4-12, 128-113 7) Raiders 4-12, 130-111 (If this happens but with a 49er win over the Texans instead, Jets jump ahead of them to the fifth pick) [url=http://www.ourlads.com/DraftSequence.html]Source[/url] Check my math, please!

KC Dec 28 2005 05:53 PM

I haven't given it a ton of thought, but given the history of how well a lot of teams do with top five picks panning out to be superstars - especially the Jets (it at least seems) - I think some consideration has to be praying for a top three pick and trading it for some more picks. There will be some teams just frothing at the mouth to do this and if the right deal can be had to get three quality bodies instead of one - why not at this point?

MFS62 Dec 28 2005 09:26 PM

Thanks, KC, but as per ESPN radio some of that could change in tie situations based on strength of schedule. And that mey not be clear until all the results are in from this coming weekend. But you did a nice job, and at least we know what we're looking forward to, pending some other game results. You would think Al Davis would have had a soft spot for an old AFL team. Later

KC Dec 28 2005 10:06 PM

No problem, I'm here to help. What did I do? ;-)

Elster88 Dec 29 2005 01:15 AM

MFS62 wrote: Thanks, KC, but as per ESPN radio some of that could change in tie situations based on strength of schedule. And that mey not be clear until all the results are in from this coming weekend. But you did a nice job, and at least we know what we're looking forward to, pending some other game results. You would think Al Davis would have had a soft spot for an old AFL team. Later Dammit, I put everything together based on strengths of schedule and who wins what. You don't need ESPN radio.

MFS62 Dec 29 2005 07:09 AM

KC wrote: No problem, I'm here to help. What did I do? ;-) Er, I guess that was Elster with the long analysis, wasn't it? (Insert sheepish emoticon here). Good job, 88. But anyhow KC, you have to admit that reading "thank you" is a lot nicer than "did you get your running in today, you fat bastard?" like you asked us to. Or does that start when your new year's resolution kicks in? You don't look that fat to me. Later

HahnSolo Dec 30 2005 09:39 AM

Elster, Since you seem to have a pretty good grasp of this topic: Does the Jets head to head loss to the Saints not matter here? What I mean is that to settle playoff ties and division ties one of the first tiebreakers is head to head matchups. So shouldn't that apply in this case as well, and wouldn't the Jets be lower than the Saints, meaning they should draft higher, if they finish with the same record?

Elster88 Dec 30 2005 09:43 AM

I'm going completely off of the web site that I linked to, I don't know anything more than what's on there. It says that head-to-head and other tie breakers (division record, conference record) only come into play if the teams have the same record and strength of schedule (SoS is what I referred to as opponent record above). With the Jets and Saints, they won't have the same SoS, so the head to head game won't matter. I was wondering the same thing, why head-to-head losses don't make up the first tie breaker. I'm guessing it's because most often they will be breaking ties between more than two teams, and usually all the teams with the same record will not have all played each other.

MFS62 Dec 30 2005 09:50 AM

From what I've been able to gather from analysts on ESPN radio, for some reason, strength of schedule is the first tie breaker after overall record. The team that played the weakest schedule gets the better pick. Why not head to head? Maybe because if it comes down to the last game of the season, some pretty horrible teams facing each other might,er,..., "play the rookies" (yeah, that's it) instead of going all out to win the game. Later

Elster88 Dec 30 2005 11:19 AM

Grrr. Do NOT listen to ESPN radio to get your info. One of the hosts was debating yesterday what the Jets should do if they get the #1 pick, which I've shown is mathematically impossible.

MFS62 Jan 01 2006 06:01 PM

Sometimes you can't win by winning. C'mon Houston. Later

KC Jan 01 2006 07:54 PM

Well, after all that - the Jets get the fourth pick. I'm just glad the season's over, I enjoy the football playoff games regardless of who's playing. Then, after the super-boring-bowl it's almost baseball season.

Edgy DC Jan 01 2006 08:18 PM

Whoah. A drop kick.

Frayed Knot Jan 02 2006 12:43 AM

Turns out that the Jets could have still snagged the #1 overall coming into today (at least according to my morning paper) but, in addition to losing the game which they didn't do, at least a million-teen other things had to break right for them ... and I'm sure at least a couple didn't. Your New York Jets ... undefeated in 2006!!!!

Vic Sage Jan 02 2006 02:51 PM

once Houston won, the best the Jets could do is the #2 pick. As it is, they dropped to #4. They could've dropped down to #7, so it wasn't as costly a win as it might otherwise have been. Was "playing to win the game" of more value to the organization than the drop from the 2nd to the 4th pick in the draft? I tend to think not.

Johnny Dickshot Jan 02 2006 03:20 PM

All this winning is horrible.

Vic Sage Jan 02 2006 03:42 PM

not all of it... just this one.

Nymr83 Jan 02 2006 04:39 PM

]once Houston won, the best the Jets could do is the #2 pick. once houston LOST the jets could have done no better than the 2 pick because houston went into the day with 2 wins while everyone else had at least 3.

Elster88 Jan 03 2006 10:45 AM

Nymr83 wrote: ]once Houston won, the best the Jets could do is the #2 pick. once houston LOST the jets could have done no better than the 2 pick because houston went into the day with 2 wins while everyone else had at least 3. For detailed information on what the wins and losses did and where the teams were coming into this weekend, please see the previous page. It was not possible for the Jets to get the #1 pick regardless of the outcome of Houston's game.

Elster88 Jan 03 2006 10:46 AM

]Turns out that the Jets could have still snagged the #1 overall coming into today (at least according to my morning paper) Goddammit. I spent a good hour putting all those numbers together. If New Orleans had lost the Jets could've had #2. There was no mathematical way they could've gotten #1. See previous page for more details.

HahnSolo Jan 04 2006 05:23 PM

FAN reporting Jets and Chiefs in talks to free up Herm to go to KC. The official parting could come as early as tonight. Said update guy: "it's not a matter of if, but when" What KC sees in Herm to give up draft picks for him is beyond me.

Nymr83 Jan 04 2006 06:00 PM

they too shall learn the joys of poor clock management...i hope we get a 2nd rounder.

Vic Sage Jan 04 2006 06:00 PM

i'll happily take a 1st rounder or 2 for Herm "Game Day" Edwards. Let defensive coordinator Robinson take over the team before he gets a head job elsewhere.

GYC Jan 04 2006 06:15 PM

Rumors right now are either: 2nd 2nd & 3rd 2nd & 5th 3rd 3rd & 5th 4th 5th Too many rumors, not enough facts. :(

Nymr83 Jan 04 2006 08:26 PM

2nd and 3rd sounds very good :)

Elster88 Jan 04 2006 09:48 PM

HahnSolo wrote: What KC sees in Herm to give up draft picks for him is beyond me. I love it! This is like being paid to have your garbage picked up. Maybe they do that in the midwest.

GYC Jan 04 2006 10:21 PM

Yeah, I was thinking that we should be giving them draft picks, not taking them.

metsmarathon Jan 05 2006 12:24 AM

hey, maybe the jets could get them to give back that larry johnson fella

Nymr83 Jan 05 2006 01:48 AM

Edwards and Martin for Johnson, lets do it!!

Matt Murdock, Esq. Jan 05 2006 01:46 PM

all we're getting is a 3rd and a 5th, looks like. feh. does anybody else sense a possible conflict of interest, with Bradway negotiating compensation with KC? Why would he want to weaken the franchise he's going to end up back with? Plus, it seems Haslett, and not Donnie Henderson, is the leading candidate for HC. Double feh. Fire Bradway now, and get a football guy to hire the next coach. And if VInce Young is there at #4, take him.

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 01:50 PM

I want no part of Vince Young. Run-first quarterbacks do not succeed in the NFL.

Matt Murdock, Esq. Jan 05 2006 02:01 PM

whoever they pick, it shouldn't be made by Bradway.

MFS62 Jan 05 2006 02:09 PM

nd why is Young only being compared to other Black quarterbacks by the tv and press "analysts"? The most frequent comparisons I've heard have been with Randall Cunningham and Roger Vick. There have been a number of White QBs in the NFL who were "runners" when they played in college and went on to NFL careers. Some that come to mind are Roger Staubach, Joe Kapp, and Alex Smith (last year's SF #1 pick). Later

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 02:29 PM

Staubach is before my time (as a football fan). I don't even know who Kapp is. Off the top of my head, the best young quarterbacks are the pocket passers. Brady and the Mannings (not that I consider Eli one of the best young quarterbacks) don't move. I don't see much of Carson Palmer, how does he move? McNabb got better when he stopped running all the time and picked his spots. Not that he's that young anymore. Vick is not a good QB, IMHO.

MFS62 Jan 05 2006 02:36 PM

Kapp spent a lot of time in the CFL (where QB mobility is at a premium)when he decided to come to the NFL, and led the Vikings to a Super Bowl (which they lost). Speaking of the Vikings, Fran Tarkenton was a pretty good runner, too. And I agree with you about Vick. Later

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 02:54 PM

Don't get me wrong, running helps make a good quarterback great. Steve Young is a good example. Elway could move pretty well. And I loved watching a non-great QB in Hoss scamper around after Simms went down in the Super Bowl year.* I just don't like a quarterback who is an amazing athlete but is not even a really good thrower. I love to watch the highlights and play with him in Madden, but I don't want him running the Jets. *As a sidenote, though I'm not a Giant fan, I think the biggest mistakes in (semi-recent) Giant history were Hoss over Simms when he came back after the Super Bowl, and Dave Brown over Simms the year after they got crushed by the Niners in the playoffs. And I liked Hoss.

Edgy DC Jan 05 2006 03:07 PM

I don't know nothing much 'bout no college football --- or birthin' babies for that matter --- but Richard Todd and Joe Namath went to Alabama, right? Presumably they were rollout quarterbacks in college who became pocket passers as pros.

HahnSolo Jan 05 2006 03:30 PM

One thing about Kapp...he couldn't throw at all. One of the reasons the Chiefs were so confident going into SB IV was the fact they were facing Kapp. A KC defender (might have been Buck Buchanan) said something to the effect that "Kapp couldn't hit the living room wall from his living room couch." Young does have a strong arm and he's improved greatly from last season as a thrower. I think he'll be a good pro. The question I have is can he do what Steve McNair did: go from a runner who could play a little QB to a strong pocket presence once his running ability disappears.

MFS62 Jan 05 2006 03:32 PM

Edgy DC wrote: I don't know nothing much 'bout no college football --- or birthin' babies for that matter --- but Richard Todd and Joe Namath went to Alabama, right? Presumably they were rollout quarterbacks in college who became pocket passers as pros. Yes indeedy. Namath's "signature" move (other than moves directed at co-eds) while at 'Bama was a jump pass off of the run . Later

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 04:00 PM

]The question I have is can he do what Steve McNair did: go from a runner who could play a little QB to a strong pocket presence once his running ability disappears. Oooh, great example. I don't see it in Young, but I ain't no football scout.

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 04:12 PM

]Texas comes roaring back with a seven-play, 80-yard drive, including an awesome 14-yard TD run by Young. Texas 23, USC 17. Screw it, why couldn't some NFL team just run the option with Vince? Wouldn't you rather have him running your team than Charlie Frye or J.P. Losman? A good point, but this wouldn't work with a starter. The option was worked to perfection as a change of pace with the Jets. I remember from the AFC championship run with Vinny, when Ray Lucas was our backup. Anytime there was an absolutely crucial 3rd down and fairly short (1-5 yards) at the Jets' forty or further in, Lucas would be put in for one play, and run the option. And it worked every...freaking...time. Every opposing coach had to know it was coming, the only time Lucas was put in was to run the option. But they could never stop it. I miss Bill.

Iubitul Jan 05 2006 04:13 PM

When it comes to running quaterbacks who made it in the NFL, only two words need to be said: Roger Staubach.

GYC Jan 05 2006 05:07 PM

I think VInce Young has more raw talent than Steve McNair, and look at what Heimerdinger did for McNair. Bring in Young.

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 05:25 PM

No fucking way in hell Young can throw better than McNair. Not even close. "Raw talent" has nothing to do with being a good NFL quarterback, if it doesn't include the arm strength and natural throwing motion. If you don't have the ability in your arm, in my (admittedly realatively uneducated) opinion odds are you don't even having the aptitude to be taught to be a good NFL QB. And if you don't have the proper throwing technique by the time you reach the NFL, then you shouldn't be there. Will apologies to Eli, no NFL quarterback should be needing lessons in throwing technique. OE: That "no fucking way in hell" is harsh. I don't mean to insult you GYC, just to emphasize how strongly I feel about that sentence. Poor choice of words on my part.

Nymr83 Jan 05 2006 05:30 PM

get your own thread for crappy QBs! J E T S jets jets jets!

Elster88 Jan 05 2006 05:38 PM

Son, this is my thread. Check the first page if you don't believe me.

Nymr83 Jan 06 2006 05:22 PM

I just heard on the radio that the Jets get a 4th rounder for Edwards...thats pretty fuckin lame.

KC Jan 06 2006 08:53 PM

I'm more concerned with what's gonna happen now. This season was just freakin' depressing and I fear the offseason still is going to heep some more gasoline on the gang green misery bonfire. NEW YORK (AP) — The Kansas City Chiefs cleared the way for Herman Edwards to become their new coach, agreeing Friday to a compensation deal with the New York Jets. The Chiefs would give the Jets a surprisingly low fourth-round pick if they hire Edwards, who has ties to the team and general manager Carl Peterson. Because Edwards was still under contract with the Jets, the Chiefs needed to give up something to get him. Chiefs spokesman Bob Moore said that Peterson was headed to New York to begin negotiations. The commissioner's office approved the fourth-round pick as compensation earlier Friday morning and granted Kansas City permission to speak with Edwards, who technically remains the head coach of the Jets. The breakthrough ended several days of speculation and behind-the-scenes maneuvering among Edwards, the Jets and the Chiefs, who are looking to replace the retired Dick Vermeil. Moore said he did not think a deal would be wrapped up right away, but added "that could change." Negotiations are not expected to be lengthy between Peterson and Edwards, who was clearly the Chiefs' first choice all along. Peterson, perhaps only to add to his bargaining leverage with New York, had also talked with Kansas City offensive coordinator Al Saunders and others. The Jets and general manager Terry Bradway are certain to be criticized for getting only a midlevel pick for giving up their coach. When the Chiefs hired Vermeil in 2000 they were forced to give St. Louis a second- and third-round pick even though he had retired after leaving the Rams. The Raiders received two No. 1s, two No. 2s and $8 million from the Tampa Bay for Jon Gruden and New England got picks in the first four rounds from the Jets for Bill Parcells. In five years in New York, Edwards was 39-41, coming just one win short of making the AFC championship game. The Jets this year, wracked by injury, slipped to 4-12, including a 27-7 opening day loss to the Chiefs. Edwards reiterated once again earlier this week he planned to be Jets coach. "I'm happy to be the coach here, and I'm going to be the coach here, like I said before, and that's as far as I want to comment on it," Edwards said Monday. Edwards seemed to be caught in a no-win situation. Though team owner Woody Johnson said in November he wanted Edwards to return, he hasn't spoken publicly since, allowing the speculation to fester. Edwards wanted a contract extension to remain with a team expected to go through a rebuilding process and a raise after making $2 million a year, among the bottom third of NFL coaches. The idea that Edwards would ask for an extension after going 4-12 may have rubbed some in the organization the wrong way, leaving them no choice but to let Edwards go. He takes over a Kansas City team that was 10-6 this past season and clearly has the potential to be a playoff team next season. The only 10-win team not in the postseason, the Chiefs have been characterized under Vermeil for their league-leading offense and a persistently bad defense. Edwards' background as a defensive player and coach was another factor in his favor. Peterson could have hired Saunders, the main architect of an offense which has pumped starters into the Pro Bowl the past four years and this season saw the emergence of running back Larry Johnson. Peterson and Edwards have been close friends for more than 30 years, since Peterson tried to recruit him to UCLA. Edwards wound up at San Jose State. By the time he graduated four years later and was ignored in the NFL draft, Peterson had become a front office executive with the Philadelphia Eagles. He had closely followed his career and immediately brought Edwards to the Eagles, where he became one of the NFL's top defensive backs, helping Vermeil's team reach the Super Bowl. Peterson later gave Edwards his first NFL job, as a personnel executive with the Chiefs. Not long afterward, he went on Marty Schottenheimer's staff as a Kansas City assistant coach. It was Peterson who recommended to Bradway that he interview Edwards for the Jets' head coach. "There are special people in your life that you meet along the way. You can see they're going places," Peterson said several months ago while discussing Edwards. Peterson later recommended that Bradway interview Edwards for the Jets head coaching job.

apmorris Jan 07 2006 02:40 AM

not a herm fan here.

Bret Sabermetric Jan 07 2006 07:18 AM

"You can see they're going places" Yeah. Kansas City.

seawolf17 Jan 07 2006 10:06 AM

Herm reminded me of Bobby V in a lot of ways, but I never really took to him the way I took to Bobby V. Seeya, Herm. Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out.

Elster88 Jan 07 2006 03:10 PM

Nymr83 wrote: I just heard on the radio that the Jets get a 4th rounder for Edwards...thats pretty fuckin lame. It's pretty fucking great. Very few coaches in history have gotten "traded" in that the team they left received compensation: Herm Edwards is not even remotely close to being in the same galaxy as those guys (I think Belichick, Parcells, Vermeil, and Gruden, though Gruden is not that special) We absolutely robbed the Chiefs blind by getting anything. I would've given KC a fourth rounder to take Herm.

apmorris Jan 07 2006 03:19 PM

"We absolutely robbed the Chiefs blind by getting anything." my heart is aglow in consensus.

Vic Sage Jan 09 2006 02:31 PM

in an absolute sense, insofar as i don't think much of Edwards and the Jets seem intent on NOT bringing him back once he made it clear that he'd prefer to go to KC, then yes, a 4th round pick is better than a sharp stick in the eye. but just barely. The fact is a team has to pay compensation if it wants to hire ANY coach with years left on his current deal. This is about the LEAST compensation i've ever heard of. which brings me back to my original point in this thread: Bradway should get tossed immediately and a new gm should be brought in to hire a new coach. If Levy and Gibbs and Parcells can all come back, lets get Jimmy Johnson in to run things.

sharpie Jan 09 2006 02:47 PM

I read somewhere that a 4th rounder is the least compensation of any "traded" coach.

MFS62 Jan 09 2006 03:16 PM

who cares? It was addition by subtraction. Later

HahnSolo Jan 09 2006 04:15 PM

It is the least amount of compensation given to any team with a coach under contract. But Herm is by far the least of those coaches. Parcells, Belichick, Vermeil, Gruden, Schottenheimer are the names that come to mind. (And I know Marty is not a great coach, but his career dwarfs Herm's, despite his poor postseason record.) The team we should be questioning is the Chiefs. Why, with a lot of candidates out there, would they give up anything for this guy?

Elster88 Jan 09 2006 04:41 PM

I look at it this way: I wanted Herm out of here last year. The only way he was going was if some other team took him. The only way another team was taking him was if that team was retarded enough to give up compensation for him. The Jets found such a team. They should be praised. A lot. I shouldn't use the term retarded, it's insulting. It's insulting to the mentally challenged. No mentally challenged person would've given up a draft pick for a sub-500 coach that can't manage the clock with two hands and a CLOCK MANAGEMENT COACH.

seawolf17 Jan 09 2006 04:47 PM

On the news the other night, they were lamenting the loss of Herm as if it were a bad thing. I haven't spoken with a single Jets fan who wants anything to do with this guy any longer; we're thrilled he's gone! They were treating it like this was such a huge tragedy. The guy won four games this year! Four! Seeya, dude!

Frayed Knot Jan 09 2006 04:56 PM

Jet fans I've heard have been everywhere on this one; - some are outraged: WE ONLY GOT A 4th ROUNDER?!?! - and some are estatic: Y'MEAN WE DIDN'T HAVE TO GIVE THEM OUR 4th ROUNDER?!?

KC Jan 09 2006 05:20 PM

More than anything, I very worried about the state of the ship. I don't trust the owner or the GM to make any rational decisions with regard to who's going to coach this team. Some of the re-tread names I'm hearing are just plain sickening. This team before injuries was supposed to go deep into the playoffs and now we're going to start all over again? Next thing ya know, Coslet will be on the list.

Nymr83 Jan 09 2006 06:21 PM

the Jets were supposed to be good this year, but given their cap problems and the age of curtis martin and part of the offensive line this was a "last chance" year. going forward with the same team next year, even if they could afford to bring everyone back which i dont think they can, wouldn't get them any farther than 2 seasons ago, and i doubt they'd even make the playoffs. it's rebuilding time, unfortunately.

Elster88 Jan 09 2006 06:55 PM

On M&MD they were saying the guy they want the most, by far, is Belichick's D-coordinator. The guy that Belichick high-fived when they made a good defensive call the other day. He was with the Jets when Parcells was here, though he didn't really have an official title. He was basically Belichick's assistant. I think they said he was in Cleveland too. Apparently when Romeo left to take his head-coaching job this past offseason he wanted to take this assistant with him. I think they said he's 35 years old, might've been 33. This is his first year as coordinator. Obviously, I know nothing about this guy, but he sounds better than hiring some loser who just got fired. I can't even remember what his name was, and I'm too lazy to look it up.

Elster88 Jan 09 2006 06:56 PM

="Frayed Knot"]- some are outraged: WE ONLY GOT A 4th ROUNDER?!?! I'm sure it'll come as no surprise that some Jet fans are morons.

HahnSolo Jan 09 2006 09:58 PM

Eric Mangini is the guy you're referring to Elster. Secondary coach with the Pats while Romeo was there, this is his first year as defensive coordinator. Supposedly he is highly regarded throughout the league, but as you state, he is only 35.

Nymr83 Jan 09 2006 10:11 PM

i think i'd rather avoid a guy with no HC experience and 1 year as D-coordinator.

Elster88 Jan 10 2006 08:57 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jan 10 2006 08:58 AM

ESPN and their associated radio station mentioned Mangini at the bottom of lists of 5 or 6, the rest being all the retreads. Francessa seems to be a really good source as far as NFL rumors go, probably stems from his connection to Parcells and working for the old NFL shows. He's a much better source than anyone working at ESPN, at least.

Elster88 Jan 10 2006 08:58 AM

Nymr83 wrote: i think i'd rather avoid a guy with no HC experience and 1 year as D-coordinator. I'm also a little worried about his lack of experience as a coordinator, but I'd much prefer a guy with no head coaching experience to some bum who got fired. These bums that I'm referring to are guys like Haslett, Martz, etc. Belichick's defensive protege can't be all bad.

Frayed Knot Jan 10 2006 01:10 PM

So it's agreed: No re-treads and no first-timers!

MFS62 Jan 10 2006 01:14 PM

Frayed Knot wrote: So it's agreed: No re-treads and no first-timers! LOL! That would leave us either a college head coach who has NFL coaching/ coordinator experience or a current CFL head coach who has never coached in the NFL. Got anybody in mind? Later

Elster88 Jan 10 2006 02:27 PM

Frayed Knot wrote: no first-timers! Who agreed with this?

Nymr83 Jan 10 2006 11:32 PM

i didn't say i'm against some long-time coordinator, just a guy with only 1 year behind him in that spot.

GYC Jan 11 2006 05:57 AM

MFS62 wrote: ="Frayed Knot"]So it's agreed: No re-treads and no first-timers! LOL! That would leave us either a college head coach who has NFL coaching/ coordinator experience or a current CFL head coach who has never coached in the NFL. Got anybody in mind? Later Kirk Ferentz

Elster88 Jan 13 2006 08:55 PM

As usual, a Bill Simmons column sums it up perfectly. The question is from a reader in his mailbag column. ]Q: I saw that the Chiefs gave away a fourth-round pick in this year's draft in order to get Herm Edwards. Do you think the Jets' front office kept a straight face during the negotiations? My guess is the conversation went something like this: "So not only do we not have to fire Herm and eat the last two years of his contract, but Kansas City is going to GIVE us something for him? What, a kickoff tee? A fourth-round pick? SELL, MORTIMER, SELL, SELL!!!!!!" --Patrick Callahan, Danvers, Mass. SG: I loved that the Jets pretended to be outraged by the whole thing -- they were like college roommates who decide to throw out their junior year sofa because it smelled like holy hell, and then the guy across the hall stops by during final exams and asks, "You guys keepin' that sofa?" And suddenly they're selling him the sofa for two cases of Miller Lite, three bags of pretzels and three packs of Marlboro Lights. That was Herm Edwards. I'm sure the Chiefs fans couldn't be happier.

Willets Point Jan 13 2006 11:37 PM

This comes from a Fark.com photoshop contest called "Soccer vs. American Football -- The Final Battle". It made me laugh.

MFS62 Jan 14 2006 10:16 AM

I don't know whether to laugh or cry - probably a little of both. They're right, though. That team coouldn't score at a Lawrence Taylor crack party. Later

metirish Jan 16 2006 10:05 PM

] Source: Jets offer Mangini head job BY KEN BERGER STAFF WRITER January 16, 2006, 8:22 PM EST On the eighth day of their search for a new head coach, the Jets decided late this afternoon to offer the job to Patriots defensive coordinator Eric Mangini, a person with knowledge of the situation told Newsday. The team is expected to finalize details on a contract that is likely to make Mangini its next coach as early as Tuesday. Barring any contractual hang-ups, Mangini, who would become the youngest head coach in the NFL at 34, is likely to accept the job. "It looks like he will," said the person, who spoke only on the condition of anonymity. "It's about as likely as anything could be." The situation remains fluid and unfinished, the person cautioned, especially since the Jets finished interviewing their final candidate, former Vikings coach Mike Tice, at 4 p.m. this afternoon. "There's still things that would have to happen and details that would have to be worked on," the person said. "But my perception is that by tomorrow morning, the Jets will have a new coach." Their choice is Mangini, the Hartford, Conn., native who has spent 10 of his 11 years as an NFL assistant with Patriots coach Bill Belichick, including the 2005 season as his defensive coordinator. "It appears as if the job will be his and the club was in the process of putting an offer on the table today," the person said. A second person connected to the Jets' search confirmed that the Jets were leaning strongly toward Mangini, but did not have first-hand knowledge that an offer was made. General manager Terry Bradway and assistant GM Mike Tannenbaum did not immediately respond to calls seeking comment. Earlier in the evening, Bradway issued a statement through a team spokesman. "No other candidates are expected at this point," Bradway said. "At this point, we are going to huddle up and review our process to this point and decide what our next plan of action is." Bradway and Tannenbaum interviewed Mangini on Sunday in Massachusetts, dined in Providence, R.I., and returned to Long Island late last night to prepare for the final interview of the week-long search, with Tice, the former Vikings head coach from Central Islip. All along, team officials had set up interviews with Mangini and Tice on back-to-back days because they viewed them as the top two candidates. Their intuition was true, especially with Tice, who "knocked it out of the park," according the second person connected to the interview process. Tice's interview was so good, the person said, that it caused the Jets' hierarchy to reassess the situation late this afternoon. But in the end, there apparently wasn't enough to dissuade the team from taking a chance on Mangini, who will turn 35 Thursday and is viewed by the Jets' hierarchy as an up-and-coming version of Belichick. Without knowing a lot about Mangini except fom what I have read this week I woould rather him that a re-thread like Tice.

metirish Jan 16 2006 10:11 PM

ESPN is reporting Mangini has accepted the job. ] ESPN.com news services The Jets wrapped up their search for a new coach Monday when Patriots defensive coordinator Eric Mangini accepted the club's offer to replace Herm Edwards. Mangini, who becomes the youngest head coach in the NFL at 34 (he turns 35 on Thursday), and the Jets were finalizing the deal late Monday, ESPN.com's Michael Smith reports. An official announcement is expected Tuesday. Mangini, who has spent nearly his entire career working for Bill Belichick, emerged as the leading candidate last week. He is regarded as one of the brightest defensive minds in the game.

Frayed Knot Jan 16 2006 10:14 PM

As is Francesa on FAN - no word on length of deal. Says also that coordinators Heimerdinger & Henderson will go elsewhere, so they'll need to fill the Lieutenant spots as well.

Frayed Knot Jan 16 2006 11:24 PM

Amazing how positive most J-E-T-S fans seem to be over a guy with absolutely no track record, who was apparently being persued by no other teams, and who most of these same giddy fans had never heard of as little as 10 days ago and would still be unable to pick out of a 2-man police lineup. "... this could be one of the greatest days in Jets' history!" Umm, if you say so.

metirish Jan 16 2006 11:31 PM

Yeah I am one of those people that never heard of Mangini 10 days ago, big deal, if as reported it was him or Tice I am happy its Mangini,I guess you knew all about Mangini FK?

Frayed Knot Jan 16 2006 11:55 PM

Me? I wouldn't know the guy if I were stuck on an elevator with him.

metirish Jan 16 2006 11:58 PM

LOL...I read he is baby faced and pudgy, that won't work in NY.

Elster88 Jan 17 2006 09:36 AM

="Frayed Knot"]Amazing how positive most J-E-T-S fans seem to be over a guy with absolutely no track record, who was apparently being persued by no other teams, and who most of these same giddy fans had never heard of as little as 10 days ago and would still be unable to pick out of a 2-man police lineup. "... this could be one of the greatest days in Jets' history!" Umm, if you say so. What are the options? Some bumbling guy who just got fired? Taking a crapshoot with a college coach (see Spurrier, S., or Carroll, P.)? Short of taking an established coach under contract, there is no better option than Mangini (or another coordinator who might be ready for the leap to head coach) this offseason. Besides, taking an "established coach" might not work, take Kansas City's new head coach for example. Just to recap the Jets coaching change, we went from a guy who can't manage the clock with the help of a CLOCK MANAGEMENT COACH, and left all scheming and game-planning up to his cooridinators.....to a guy who has worked and learned from a great defensive mind for the past decade, and is considered an excellent defensive mind in his own right. Seems like a pretty fucking great upgrade. Did I mention that we robbed Kansas City out of draft pick?

Elster88 Jan 17 2006 09:44 AM

]"... this could be one of the greatest days in Jets' history!" Umm, if you say so. You do make a good point though. Most Jet fans are like most Yankee fans, most Met fans, most Giant fans, etc. They overreact to an incredible degree when something looks good, and they bitch and moan for days when something looks bad. Intelligent Jet fans probably realize that personnel and cap issues will be a huge obstacle for any incoming head coach. They also realize that even a great coach can have a shitty record when they get bad players, including Belichick and his coaching staff (which included Mangini) in Cleveland. I'm guessing you heard that statement on the radio. I don't think you should be amazed if some idiot (or group of idiots) gets excited and utters words along the lines you quoted.

Elster88 Jan 17 2006 09:46 AM

OTOH, I am personally amazed and excited that we were able to dump Herm without firing him. It's a good day to be a Jet fan. If some fool wants to make dumbass statements to keep himself happy, God bless him. He can have his fun today.

Frayed Knot Jan 17 2006 12:46 PM

It's not that I think Jet fans shouldn't be positive about this. It's just that some (read: most) of the reactions seem more than a bit over the top for a guy of Magini's resume. It's as if they've decided that not only does this guy with a promising background have the potential to become a terrific coach for the future, but that this: 'no HC experience / 1 yr as coordinator / most couldn't distinguish him from the team accountant' guy somehow already is. I think fans often fall in love with the idea of a guy. It's like what you see when a politician jumps onto the national stage (like a Colin Powell type for ex.) He becomes instantly popular because he's never done anything "wrong" and so many use his likeable backstory (in Magini's case the Parcells/Bellecek pedigree) to build an image in their minds that he'll be just the one they're looking across the board. It's a variation of the 'backup quarterback syndrome'; he's never thrown an interception ergo he must be better than the starter.

seawolf17 Jan 17 2006 12:48 PM

="Frayed Knot"]It's not that I think Jet fans shouldn't be positive about this. It's just that some (read: most) of the reactions seem more than a bit over the top for a guy of Magini's resume. It's as if they've decided that not only does this guy with a promising background have the potential to become a terrific coach for the future, but that this: 'no HC experience / 1 yr as coordinator / most couldn't distinguish him from the team accountant' guy somehow already is. I think fans often fall in love with the idea of a guy. It's like what you see when a politician jumps onto the national stage (like a Colin Powell type for ex.) He becomes instantly popular because he's never done anything "wrong" and so many use his likeable backstory (in Magini's case the Parcells/Bellecek pedigree) to build an image in their minds that he'll be just the one they're looking across the board. It's a variation of the 'backup quarterback syndrome'; he's never thrown an interception ergo he must be better than the starter. Cough cough Willierandolph cough cough.

Frayed Knot Jan 17 2006 01:20 PM

Except that I don't remember fans crowing about Willie - who had more of a resume than Magini - like he was a savior type. Fan reaction to Willie was mixed at best last year, not "Glory Hellelujah we've been rescued!!"

KC Jan 17 2006 02:45 PM

Well if we're going to start from scratch, I think they made a decent choice. I actually jokingly predicted this Saturday night after the Patriot game by say- ing to my buds, "good, now that the Pats are out of it let's steal one of their co- ordinators from them". I guess Hermadinger (whatever his name is) and Robinson are leaving too. Nothing wrong with hiring a young guy who's worked for Parcells and Belichick.

Nymr83 Jan 17 2006 03:18 PM

i wont miss hemierdinger... i said many times this year that he pulled Hackett's playbook out of the trash can his first day on the job and just went with it... i'd like to let the HC bring in who he wants and then hold HIM accountable instead of having an OC left over from the previous regime followed by a replacement signed 5 minutes after firing the other guy. I see no reason for Westoff not to stay, but again i do believe it should be up to the HC.

GYC Jan 17 2006 04:39 PM

Nymr83 wrote: i wont miss hemierdinger... i said many times this year that he pulled Hackett's playbook out of the trash can his first day on the job and just went with it... i'd like to let the HC bring in who he wants and then hold HIM accountable instead of having an OC left over from the previous regime followed by a replacement signed 5 minutes after firing the other guy. I see no reason for Westoff not to stay, but again i do believe it should be up to the HC. I have a feeling Heimerdinger was being restrained by Herm; that's why once Martin went down, you saw the playbook open up a bit; it seemed that Herm's only goal after Chad + Jay went down was to get Curtis his 1,000 yards at all costs. After Curtis went down, you saw Brooks passing for over 320 yards against Miami. As far as Mangini, he's been speculated to be the DC for NE for 2 or 3 years to replace Crennel, but everytime teams wouldn't wait for the end of the Playoffs; its not like he is some complete unknown, at least if you follow football news religiously for all teams (I have no life). I'm happy to see him here.

Elster88 Jan 25 2006 09:13 PM

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2306073]Heimerdinger leaving.[/url]

Vic Sage Jan 26 2006 01:14 PM

S'long, and don't let the towel snap yer ass on the way out!

PatchyFogg Jan 27 2006 11:49 AM

We had Jets beat writer Randy Lange from the Bergen Record on with us last night. I didn’t book him until late in the day so I couldn’t solicit your questions or even give a heads up to those in the listening area. But, I think we touched on everything that a Jets fan might want to know right now. The interview itself is 51 commercial-free minutes long, and it is all Jets talk. We do spend about 2 or 3 minutes on the Super Bowl, but even then we discuss Doug Jolley vs. Heath Miller. Here is the link: http://hosted.filefront.com/patchyfogg Here are the topics discussed--in the order in which they were discussed: --Herm --Eric Mangini --Tannenbaum & Bradway --Mike Tice coming in 2nd --Assistant coaches --Offensive Coordinator candidates --Defensive Coordinator talk (including Donnie and Sutton) --Assistant coaches and the press --The Heimerdinger saga --The QB situation --D’Brickashaw Ferguson --The Offensive line --The salary cap situation --Ty Law --Curtis Martin --The John Abraham situation --Vilma --The Draft --Doug Jolley --Rumors of TO or Moss coming to the Jets --Super Bowl --Woody Johnson --The team’s future in Hempstead --Randy’s recent book on Jets history --Randy’s appreciation of Jets fansites As always, thanks and I hope you enjoy. Please tell a friend.

Elster88 Jan 31 2006 11:40 AM

Vic Sage wrote: S'long, and don't let the towel snap yer ass on the way out! Not that I love him, but what did Dinger do that was bad? Didn't have much to work with this year.

Nymr83 Jan 31 2006 12:42 PM

the Post today says they are bringing in Schottenheimer's son who was a QB coach in San Diego.... obviously i know nothing about the guy but i just don't like the idea of hiring a guy who has only worked for "daddy" so far.

HahnSolo Feb 07 2006 01:07 PM

Major Jet news conference for later today: Tannenbaum to become GM. Bradway taking on a lesser role. Not sure how I like this. I wasn't a Bradway fan, but Tannenbaum is simply a cap guy. And he's very close to Mangini

Elster88 Feb 07 2006 03:43 PM

Bradway didn't do anything too terribly. I don't claim to know enough about either of them to have much of a reaction to this. Time will tell. ____________________ This post had the designation 68) Al Jackson

MFS62 Feb 07 2006 04:09 PM

Only one player Bradway drafted in his regime has made the Pro Bowl. That is not good. His strength was supposed to have been player evaluation. Tannenbaum is a numbers/ cap guy. Bradway is staying on as a consultant. That means Tannenbaum will need to add a talent evaluator. Later

seawolf17 Feb 07 2006 04:12 PM

MFS62 wrote: Only one player Bradway drafted in his regime has made the Pro Bowl. That is not good. And zero teams Bradway assembled in his regime won any championships. That is not good either.

KC Feb 07 2006 04:15 PM

Doesn't matter, the Jets will never win a championship while I have season tickets. What's going to happen is seat licensing will force me to give up my seats and then they're going to go on a long championship tear. I had a vision of what's to come.

Elster88 Feb 07 2006 04:18 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 07 2006 04:26 PM

Wow. Unfair-edness abounds. ]Only one player Bradway drafted in his regime has made the Pro Bowl. That is not good. There have been plenty of discussions in this space about the ways all teams screw up in the draft. ]And zero teams Bradway assembled in his regime won any championships. That is not good either. With a different head coach the Jets make the AFC championship last year. The Jets have gotten to the playoffs at a higher rate recently than at any other time in Jets history. Less that 40 different general managers in history have assembled championship teams. ____________________ Cut the guy some slack. It's been fun to be a Jet fan recently.

metirish Feb 07 2006 04:23 PM

Is players going to the pro-bowl a fair way to judge a GM?, I would think not.

seawolf17 Feb 07 2006 04:34 PM

Nymr83 wrote: the Post today says they are bringing in Schottenheimer's son who was a QB coach in San Diego.... obviously i know nothing about the guy but i just don't like the idea of hiring a guy who has only worked for "daddy" so far. They're just doing that so they only have to change the "DINGER" part of the nameplate on the office door.

HahnSolo Feb 07 2006 04:44 PM

]Is players going to the pro-bowl a fair way to judge a GM?, I would think not. Not totally fair, but it is a legitimate concern. You can probably point to only one star currently with the Jets that he drafted: Jonathan Vilma. That's over five drafts, and that's not good.

MFS62 Feb 07 2006 05:01 PM

metirish wrote: Is players going to the pro-bowl a fair way to judge a GM?, I would think not. It IS a way to judge talent evaluation. And that was supposedly his strength. His job is to get the coach the best players. And IMO, election to the Pro Bowl is a valid way of measuring "best players". There are 80+ players named from 30 teams. That comes out to 2+ players per team/ per year. And in the years since Bradway has been GM, only one player he drafted has been named to that game. And Vilma was there this year only because the guy elected to the team is injured. Later

metirish Feb 07 2006 06:14 PM

well when you put it way 62 then fair enough.

Nymr83 Feb 07 2006 10:31 PM

i think that is a fair way to evaluate but its too soon to make that evaluation... Vilma is good, if Robertson makes that leap next year Bradway suddenly looks better, who else did he take i dont feel like looking

Elster88 Feb 07 2006 10:33 PM

MFS62 wrote: ="metirish"]Is players going to the pro-bowl a fair way to judge a GM?, I would think not. It IS a way to judge talent evaluation. And that was supposedly his strength. His job is to get the coach the best players. And IMO, election to the Pro Bowl is a valid way of measuring "best players". There are 80+ players named from 30 teams. That comes out to 2+ players per team/ per year. And in the years since Bradway has been GM, only one player he drafted has been named to that game. This is unfair. It's not like in the years that Bradway has been GM that all these other teams have been drafting 2+ Pro-Bowl players a year. Some of those Pro-Bowlers were drafted before Bradway took over as GM. Many of them repeat as Pro Bowl picks. Also, there are other facets to his job. The way to judge a GM is on his win-loss record. Not his Pro Bowl selections.

apmorris Feb 16 2006 02:28 PM

culpepper anyone?

Elster88 Feb 16 2006 02:56 PM

Culpepper is an awful quarterback. If you post his name again with regards to the Jets I will electroshock you through your keyboard.

MFS62 Feb 16 2006 03:06 PM

I just got a call from the Jets. They want to renegotiate my contract. Later

apmorris Feb 16 2006 07:51 PM

I concur.

KC Feb 18 2006 02:50 PM

I still don't get the Dante slant by ap ... never in a million years will that happen. Looks like Chad's days might be numbered which is fine with me - they only have until Thursday to deal with the Abraham situation.

apmorris Feb 18 2006 04:10 PM

KC wrote: I still don't get the Dante slant by ap ... never in a million years will that happen. NY along with Arizona and Baltimore were mentioned as places DC might end up in. I dont see DC as a negative for the Jets compared to what they got now. I dont mind him plus a first round QB, I wonder if DC could take to mentoring a young soon to be star[ter] in waiting. BUT of course, Drew Brees sounds better. "The Chargers have all but ruled out the possibility of placing the franchise or transition tag on quarterback Drew Brees, leaving them only two options: signing him to a new contract or letting him hit the free-agent market." from > http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=2334609&type=story What to do @ QB needs to be the first order of business for the Jets. ( ... duh )

Nymr83 Feb 18 2006 04:37 PM

the jets are in pretty bad shape- way over the cap with injured stars at the 2 biggest positions... if only someone had listened when i was screaming to keep Jordan.

Elster88 Feb 20 2006 09:06 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Feb 20 2006 04:03 PM

Drew Brees is also a terrible idea. If you want a quarterback coming off surgery on his throwing arm, just keep Pennington. You're 0 for 2 boss.

Elster88 Feb 20 2006 01:35 PM

The New York Jets announced today their 2006 coaching staff. The announcement of the composition of the coaching staff was made by Head Coach Eric Mangini. Joining Mangini on the coaching staff will be (in alphabetical order): Richie Anderson, assistant wide receivers coach; Brett Bech, assistant strength and conditioning coach; Corwin Brown, defensive backs coach; Bryan Cox, assistant defensive line coach; Mike Devlin, assistant offensive line coach; Andy Dickerson, coaches assistant; Sam Gash, assistant running backs/special teams coach; Jim Herrmann, linebackers coach; Rick Lyle, assistant strength and conditioning coach; Denny Marcin, defensive line coach; Jason Mandolesi, defensive quality control; Noel Mazzone, wide receivers coach; Jason Michael, offensive quality control; Markus Paul, head strength and conditioning coach; Jimmy Raye, running backs coach; Brian Schottenheimer, offensive coordinator; Bob Sutton; defensive coordinator; Mike Westhoff; special teams coordinator; and Tony Wise, offensive line coach.

HahnSolo Feb 20 2006 02:05 PM

Richie Anderson and Sam Gash ... we're covered if we have a run of injuries at fullback.

Nymr83 Feb 20 2006 03:39 PM

what exactly are the jobs of the offensive and defensive "quality control" coaches?

HahnSolo Feb 20 2006 05:19 PM

I don't know the specifics, but I think they're sort of assistants to the assistants. Low on the totem pole guys. Mangini's first job with the Jets I believe was defensive quality control (as Belichick's right hand man).

MFS62 Feb 20 2006 05:49 PM

Nymr83 wrote: what exactly are the jobs of the offensive and defensive "quality control" coaches? I think they check the film of the prior game and "score" the players. I heard Mangini's first job described as a "tape head". What I'm wondering about is why is Cox coaching the line? He was an all-pro linebacker. Why isn't he the linebacker coach? Later

Elster88 Feb 20 2006 09:44 PM

I'm wondering if it's the same Bryan Cox. It'd be quite a coincidence if it isn't, but I didn't peg him as a coaching-type.

KC Feb 21 2006 02:43 PM

Jets Designate John Abraham As Franchise Player The New York Jets announced today that defensive end John Abraham has been designated as the Club's franchise player. The announcement was made by Jets' General Manager Mike Tannenbaum. Abraham, 27, joined the Jets as a first-round draft choice in 2000 (the second of the team's four first-rounds picks that season) out of the University of South Carolina. The 6-4, 258-pound native of Timmonsville, SC has played in 73 career regular season games, making 63 starts, and registered 328 tackles, along with 53.5 sacks, which represent the fourth-most sacks in team annals, trailing only Mark Gastineau (107.5), Joe Klecko (77.5) and Gerry Philbin (64.5). "The franchise tag is one of the resources we have to protect ourselves in a competitive league," said Tannenbaum. "By franchising John, it speaks volumes about what type of player we feel he is and we stand behind our decision, with the full realization that at this point in time it is in the best interest of the club from both a financial and competitive standpoint." Read the entire release at newyorkjets.com

metirish Feb 22 2006 12:27 PM

[url=http://www.newsday.com/sports/football/jets/ny-spjets0223,0,3912794.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines]Jets saving money[/url]

PatchyFogg Feb 22 2006 12:57 PM

We had Jets beat writer Randy Lange (from the Bergen Record) on live with us last night. Please go here for the interview: http://hosted.filefront.com/patchyfogg For some reason, there was a tremendous amount of static in the area that was going to be picked up by the sound board, so I had the decrease my mic’s input into the board. As a result, you might not clearly hear my question but Randy (which is the most important thing) can be heard loud and clear. If you were listening over the air, you could hear me fine, as well. So, I’ve provided a list of topics discussed in the 39 commercial-free minute interview (in chronological order) as a guide: --All things Tannenbaum, Mangini and Bradway --The Franchise Tag on Abraham --The Salary Cap --Fabini and Sowell out --All things Chad --Jay Cutler --Using Abraham as a trade chip --Why Randy thinks the Chargers would not be a good landing place for Abraham, but the Lions would --Mangini, the Jets and the 3-4 --The new regime and access to the media --The now infamous conference call --Curtis Martin --The coaching staff --The lack of a TE coach --Mike Westhoff staying --The Jets’ future at Hofstra --The training sites in New Jersey --The new stadium --Whether Randy will be adding chapters to his book with all that has happened lately --Curt Gowdy and the Jets --SNY and the Jets --Jets 24/7 --Jay Fiedler --Mawae and Kendall

KC Feb 22 2006 02:43 PM

Jets is busy people .... Jets and Curtis Martin Reach Agreement To A Restructured Contract The New York Jets and running back Curtis Martin, the NFL's fourth-ranked all-time leading rusher, have mutually agreed today to a restructured contract. As per Club policy terms and length of the contract were undisclosed. The announcement was made by Jets' General Manager Mike Tannenbaum. Martin, who will be entering his 12th NFL season and his ninth with the Jets, is the fourth-leading rusher in NFL history with 14,101 yards on 3,518 carries. The former University of Pittsburgh star joined the team as a restricted free agent in March of 1998. With the Jets, Martin has established Club-records in nearly every rushing category, including: rushing yards (10,302), rushing attempts (2,560), rushing touchdowns (58), 100-yard rushing games (43), and yards from scrimmage (12,741). "Curtis Martin is a special person and a player destined for the Pro Football Hall of Fame," said Tannenbaum. "He has confirmed through his actions that he is always seeking ways to help the New York Jets win football games and to lead the team both verbally and through his extremely high level of play. Curtis places the accomplishments of the team ahead of his personal goals and is willing to sacrifice in all areas of the arena for the New York Jets. He has set aside what may be in his best short-term interest for the immediate and long-term goals of this organization. We are truly fortunate to have Curtis as one of the unquestioned leaders of the organization on the football field and in our community." "I have known Curtis Martin for the past eight years and have always had the highest regards for him as both an individual and as one of the fiercest and most determined athletes in the game of professional football," said Head Coach Eric Mangini. "Curtis has demonstrated through both his words and his actions how important it is for him to lead the Jets to the highest level in this game. He is a smart, tough, competitive and a hard-working player that has placed football paramount amongst his priorities in life. His actions, through the agreement we reached today, demonstrate what a selfless individual he truly he is." In 2005 Martin started the first 12 games of the season before a knee injury forced him to the injured reserve list for the final four contests. He led the team in rushing with 735 yards on 220 carries and a tied for the team high in touchdowns with five. He also added 118 yards receiving on 24 receptions, the fifth-most on the team. Read the entire release at newyorkjets.com

Nymr83 Feb 22 2006 02:50 PM

Rotoworld is reporting htat the Jets have cut Ty Law, Jay Fiedler, Jason Fabini, and 4 others.

MFS62 Feb 22 2006 03:08 PM

They also cut FB Gerald Sowell and OL Kendall, who played center when Mawai was hurt last year. I would keep Kendall around. With the release of Sowell, they will need someone to block for whoever is at QB and RB. That list makes me fairly certain that they will go after OL help with at least two of their first three draft picks. But Kendall is a veteran insurance for the OL. Later

metirish Mar 02 2006 04:45 PM

Just heard on the FAN that Kevin Mawae will get released by the Jets tonight, will Chad?

KC Mar 02 2006 05:03 PM

There's a wire story that the NFL has extended the FA deadline three days - the deadline was today at 4.

Nymr83 Mar 03 2006 09:51 PM

they have indeed extended it 3 days, whether this helps or not we'll see. Pennington isn't being very smart imo, he gets $0 if they cut him right? i doubt in the current market (tons of talent being released for cap reasons) he would get more than the veteran minimum and a chance to be the backup anywhere else, he should be happy to take the incentives laden deal from the jets if those incentives are based on games played, he won't get a better deal.

Elster88 Mar 14 2006 10:02 PM

Mawae to play for the Titans next year.

apmorris Mar 16 2006 01:13 PM

Now, who do you want for QB: Leinart Ramsey or Cutler?

Vic Sage Mar 17 2006 10:34 AM

Young could be available at the 4th pick.

Elster88 Mar 17 2006 11:39 AM

Keep Vince fucking Young away from the Jets.

apmorris Mar 17 2006 01:09 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Mar 18 2006 12:56 AM

Vince Young throws the ball off the wrong foot while using the wrong hand - at least that how it looks.

Vic Sage Mar 17 2006 01:18 PM

I'm not saying i want VF Young, either. I'm just saying i think he'll be on the board, and if they haven't traded for Ramsey, they might be tempted. Leinhart will likely be gone, and I don't know enough about Cutler to say he's a legit #4 pick, especially since the Jets have holes everywhere and they just need to take the best available player, regardless of position. There are some killer OLs and DLs rated that high, and the Jets need some. Unless they think Cutler or VF Young are franchise quarterbacks... then they'll have to pull the trigger, because they don't come around everyday, and you need one to win, and Chad ain't it no more. Neither, frankly, is Patrick Ramsay.

Elster88 Mar 17 2006 03:03 PM

I wish they could trade up to 2, but it doesn't appear to be happening.

apmorris Mar 18 2006 12:55 AM

Redskins trade QB Ramsey to Jets sh*t. from > http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/football/nfl/03/17/bc.fbn.jets.redskinstra.ap/index.html

Nymr83 Mar 18 2006 01:56 PM

If you're going with Pennington, Ramsey is a useful backup. I don't care too much about the 6th round pick. Abraham is rumored to have agreed to a deal with the Falcons, though the Falcons won't give their 1st rounder to the Jets so that may just be a foolish move on his part. Seattle is willing to give their pick up (31st) but haven't negotiated with Abraham...

Vic Sage Mar 20 2006 10:10 AM

The difference between Altanta's mid-2nd rounder and Seattle's low-1st rounder is 16 slots, which isn't earth-shattering. If Abraham is adamant about going to Altanta (which he appears to be), then i don't see what choice the Jets have but to pull the trigger, unless they're actually willing to go into the season with a disgruntled Abraham playing out of position in a 3-4 alignment. And i don't think they are. On draft day, with an extra 2nd and an extra 4th, they might be able to package them for a low-1st rounder, if there is somebody still on the board they really want and there's a team thats willing to move down to get more picks. a 6th for Ramsey is a good deal. He's still young, strong, talented. As a backup, he's terrific. As a starter, he's probably better than Chad, at this point. And it reduces the need to pick a QB at #4. Mario Williams, meet Mr. Mangini. Mr. Mangini, Mr. Williams.

MFS62 Mar 21 2006 08:45 PM

Abraham finally traded to Atlanta (for the 29th pick) Denver involved, too. http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=AnovN6O1XlMH1lyjDwxdFyZDubYF?slug=ap-jets-abrahamtrade&prov=ap&type=lgns Later

metirish Mar 21 2006 09:01 PM

I'm no expert but is that all they could get for him?

MFS62 Mar 21 2006 09:21 PM

Recent reports indicated that they would have been willing to settle for Seattle's #1, the 31st pick, so this is two picks better. Abraham has talent, but hasn't been the best of competitors when the chips were down. I doubt they were expecting much more.The Jets would have been happy to get decent return for him. And they did. Later

Nymr83 Mar 21 2006 09:46 PM

last year was his only healthy one in the last 3, i'm glad that at least one NY team understands trading players at the peak of their value for something you need (a 1st rounder) instead of waiting for another injury to happen and then getting a 3rd rounder for him after he holds out again and plays in 10 games this year due to injury.

Elster88 Mar 22 2006 12:52 AM

What are you talking about? I want names and dates.

Vic Sage Mar 22 2006 11:30 AM

They'll miss his pass rush, but if they get Mario Williams, they won't be devasted. The late 1st rounder is about all they were expecting, considering Abraham's injury history, contract demands, and public diatribes against playing for the Jets next season. I'm fine with it, but it depends on what they do in the draft. Because they can't fill Abraham's shoes with any old free agent.

Nymr83 Mar 24 2006 09:44 PM

i don't feel the need to "fill his shoes" at all. Sure he was a great pass-rusher but the Jets can get by with someone who can do a better job run-stopping without the flashy sack numbers. With huge holes at the two most important positions (QB and RB) the Jets need a plan for the future not Abraham for one more year after which he could have walked sans compensation.

Matt Murdock, Esq. Mar 26 2006 01:31 AM

QB and RB are the last pieces you get, not the first. You build from the inside out... on the offensive and defensive lines. That is where games are won and lost. You fill the glamour positions once you've built your lines... otherwise your fancy new QB ends up on his ass, and that great new RB gets no holes to run through. And he won't be running anyway, because the defense isn't holding the other team, so your playing catch up and throwing all day... which you can't do, because your QB is on his ass. Its all well and good to talk about replacing Abraham with a "run stopper", but a pass rush is a necessary element of an effective D, and ours is now playing in Atlanta. Ellis and Robertson are 2/3 of our 3 man line, and they can't put enough pressure on a QB without a speed rusher coming off the end. If we don't "fill his shoes", then you have to start blitzing, which exposes you to other problems.

Nymr83 Mar 26 2006 11:12 PM

you're almost always "blitzing" 1 guy in a 3-4. the ends arent pass rushing as much, they're clogging up space so the linebackers can do their jobs

Elster88 Apr 14 2006 08:38 PM

Please, I beg you. Do not draft Vince Young.

Nymr83 Apr 16 2006 10:03 PM

Hypothetical: Bush goes 1st. Young goes 2nd. Williams goes 3rd. Jet fans: what do you do? I take Ferguson. We need O-line help and I'd like to give Chad one more season at QB to see if he has anything. None of the QBs available are, in my opinion, a "franchise guy" so there is no harm in passing on them and taking one a year or three down the road if Pennington stinks the joint up. With the 2nd pick i'd be looking at D-line help. After that flyers on a RB, WR, and more O-linemen would be good. Thoughts?

*62 Apr 16 2006 10:17 PM

="Elster88"]Please, I beg you. Do not draft Vince Young. From your mouth to His ear.

Vic Sage Apr 17 2006 05:27 PM

They could play up their interest in a QB, forcing a team to trade up to get a shot at one of Young, Leinart or Cutler. Then the Jets should draft best available player, since they have so many holes to fill, plus the extra picks or players they get for trading down. i'd be happy with drafting either Hawk, Ferguson or Williams, any of whom are still likely to be available a few slots down. I'm less enamored of picking a "skill" player at #4 because i don't think this draft has any impact offensive players, other than Bush (and maybe that TE, Davis). Anyhow, I wouldn't cry if we got any of those players at #4 either, even without picking up extra goodies for trading down.

PatchyFogg Apr 28 2006 02:59 PM

We had Jets beat writer Rich Cimini from the Daily News on with us last night on my 100% commercial-free, no one makes a dime from it, Long Island Sports Talk radio show. It's 47+ commercial-free minutes of Jets Draft Preview. We will have Randy Lange from the Bergen Record on with us next week to do a Jets Draft Review. Our usual interview site (http://hosted.filefront.com/patchyfogg) is having uploading problems today, so I had to find a work-around. As such, please go here for the interview: http://www.filecoast.com/index.php?pg=file&c1=2292497904&c2=rsUPcL59 I will do my little write-up (transcript) as the day goes on, but I wanted to get this up as soon as possible. If anyone wants to host the interview somewhere else or can recommend another free downloading service, please let me know. And, if anyone else wants to type up some tidbits from the interview as they listen, that would be great, too. As always, thanks.

Vic Sage May 01 2006 01:52 PM

good draft for the Jets. I like the new offensive line, and the 2 new QBs. But we still need a pass rushing end. If we get a pass rush, we'll go at least 8-8, maybe even 9-7. Without one, 7-9 is the best we'll do... 6-10 more likely. and yes, i pulled those numbers completely out of my ass.

GYC May 01 2006 10:42 PM

I freaking love the draft.

Nymr83 May 02 2006 12:09 AM

Vic Sage wrote: If we get a pass rush, we'll go at least 8-8, maybe even 9-7. Without one, 7-9 is the best we'll do... 6-10 more likely. and yes, i pulled those numbers completely out of my ass. IMO this is a 5-7 win team no matter what they did in the draft, they are building for the future (hopefully 2007 or 2008 at the latest) 2006 needs to be abandoned in favor of a plan to win later on. the jets did that by avoiding big names and instead taking guys who wil help for years to come in the first round.

PatchyFogg May 05 2006 10:23 AM

We had Jets beat writer Randy Lange from the Bergen Record on with us last night. Here is the link: http://hosted.filefront.com/patchyfogg The interview itself is 56 commercial-free minutes of nothing but Jets talk. As always, thanks for listening.