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Mets going to the Hall of Fame

Triple Dee Mar 14 2008 06:14 AM

Which of the following current or recently retired (<5 years) Mets do you think will get into Cooperstown? (BR HoF Monitor provided; 100 = good possibility) Note: I'm not asking whether they deserve to get in, but whether they will get in. Carlos Delgado (100) Carlos Beltran (71) John Franco (124) Johan Santana (63) Billy Wagner (104) David Cone (103) Jeff Kent (124) Jose Reyes (25) David Wright (40)

Frayed Knot Mar 14 2008 06:43 AM

No maybe no maybe no no no maybe maybe

Benjamin Grimm Mar 14 2008 06:47 AM

I agree with Frayed Knot, except that I'd give Kent a maybe.

AG/DC Mar 14 2008 07:07 AM

I'm giving Kent a Yes. He's just not that much of a Met.

soupcan Mar 14 2008 07:25 AM Re: Mets going to the Hall of Fame

Carlos Delgado - no Carlos Beltran - probably not John Franco - no Johan Santana - probably Billy Wagner - no David Cone - no Jeff Kent - yes Jose Reyes - too early to tell David Wright - too early to tell

Frayed Knot Mar 14 2008 07:40 AM

Yeah, I shouldn't have dismissed Kent so quickly. He's the only one there close enough to the end of his career where you can actually talk about the HoF even if he quit today. Beltran, Santana, (and esp) Wright & Reyes are just too early to even discuss.

seawolf17 Mar 14 2008 07:41 AM

Carlos Delgado (100) - Probably not. Too many 1B in line ahead of him: Jeff Bagwell and Frank Thomas immediately come to mind. Carlos Beltran (71) - Give him another couple of years, and he's a definite maybe. He has the ability, and he's certainly paid like a HoFer, but can he hold up over time? John Franco (124) - HA! Johan Santana (63) - See Beltran, Carlos. Billy Wagner (104) - HA! David Cone (103) - Interesting, but no way. Again, too many guys in line ahead of him. Jeff Kent (124) - Here's a good case. His most similar careers are all catchers (!!) -- Yogi, Fisk, Pudge, Bench -- but their scores are in the 800s, which means they're similar but not that similar. GettingHoF catcher offense out of your second baseman? That's pretty good. Combine that with the MVP votes, and he's got a compelling case. I don't think he gets in right away, but he could be a guy who hangs around the periphery for seven or eight years as people realize what a good player he actually was. Jose Reyes (25) - Waaaay too early to tell, but I'd love to say yes. David Wright (40) - See Reyes, Jose.

AG/DC Mar 14 2008 07:48 AM

Are the Hall of Fame Standards for closers still so nebulous that a guy that gets a wwhopping 124 on the HoF Monitor gets a HA! from fans of the team he spent half his career with? Or, to put it another way, that a guy that gets a HA! from fans of the team he spent half his career with gets a wwhopping 124 on the HoF Monitor?

Triple Dee Mar 14 2008 08:38 AM

="AG/DC"]Are the Hall of Fame Standards for closers still so nebulous that a guy that gets a wwhopping 124 on the HoF Monitor gets a HA! from fans of the team he spent half his career with? Or, to put it another way, that a guy that gets a HA! from fans of the team he spent half his career with gets a wwhopping 124 on the HoF Monitor? Think of the "HA" as retribution for all the near cardic moments he gave Mets fans over the years. The truth is the BR's HoF monitor is seldomly given credence by voters. Bruce Sutter has a HoFM of 91, while Franco's 124 is close to a "virtual clinch" (130). Few people are going to argue the Franco was a better pitcher.

AG/DC Mar 14 2008 08:57 AM

And that's a big part of what I'm talking about. The standards are so nebulous that the monitor can't be/hasn't been calibrated to even closely represent the consensus or the voters, which is really what it's supposed to represent. The other part is the inablity or unwillingness of fans of any team to seperate the cardiac nature of a closer's job from the cardiac moments he gave them.

TheOldMole Mar 14 2008 10:04 AM

I wouldn't rule Delgado out. I can't go for Kent, whether he deserves it or not.

TheOldMole Mar 14 2008 10:06 AM

Nobody, especially the Hall voters, knows what the HOF standards are for relief pitchers.

Vic Sage Mar 14 2008 10:18 AM Re: Mets going to the Hall of Fame

Carlos Delgado - NO. he's finished and he's had neither the peak nor the career numbers to warrant serious discussion. Carlos Beltran - probably not. He'd have to play another 10 years, with at least 5 years at or near his 2006 level. And his injuries have been chronic enough to cast doubt on that happening. John Franco - An accumulator. IF Lee Smith isn't in, Franco doesn't get in. Johan Santana - way too soon to tell. Like any pitcher, his arm could fall off tomorrow. that being said, he's certainly had HOF type years so far. Billy Wagner - More dominant than Franco, but hasn't accumulated the numbers. In any event, he's not Gossage, Fingers, Sutter or even Lee Smith. While that shouldn't necessarily be the criteria, it probably is. David Cone - high peak, but no. Just not enough. Jeff Kent - definite maybe. One of the most prolific 2bmen of his generation. Jose Reyes - he has further to go than either Wright or Santana, but he could make it. Or not. David Wright - unlike Reyes, he doesn't have to continue developing. He just needs to keep doing what he's doing for another 10-15 years or so. But that isn't as easy as it sounds. And it sounds pretty hard.

Gwreck Mar 14 2008 10:54 AM

Reyes, Wright and Santana are all "on pace" but way too early to tell as everyone else has said. Beltran I think needs to have a few big years -- and MVP season, etc., to get him on track. If he repeated his first 8 years over the next 8 years, I don't think that's a good enough pace. Delgado is the interesting one. I think he'll need at least another 100 home runs, but if the hall voters insist on keeping McGwire out -- and we can of course presume they'll do the same for Palmeiro -- and who knows who else, then he has a shot, what with the 500+ homeruns usually guaranteeing induction.