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Rico Brogna, Good Fit (and other ex-Met updates)

Swan Swan H Jun 05 2005 10:02 AM

A new-board restart for one of my favorite threads, the ezboard version of which was started by The Big Train. Ol' Dolphin Face has been [url=http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-braves-hampton&prov=ap&type=lgns] disabled again [/url] by the Braves. Also, Eddie Murray has been [url=http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=indiansmurray&prov=st&type=lgns] fired[/url] as hitting coach by Cleveland.

ScarletKnight41 Jun 05 2005 10:11 AM

I've always found the phrase strange when I read that a team has disabled a player. It sounds like they took him out back and roughed him over.

Swan Swan H Jun 05 2005 10:13 AM

If I ever read that the Yanks disabled Kevin Brown or Jason Giambi, that just might be the case.

Nymr83 Jun 05 2005 08:47 PM

lol. i have a Brogna jersey in my closet to this day.

Elster88 Jun 05 2005 10:48 PM

Kenny Rogers leading the AL with an ERA around 1.70.

ScarletKnight41 Jun 05 2005 10:49 PM

Elster - who were you at ezBoard?

Elster88 Jun 05 2005 11:02 PM

ejflor. Gender = M

Edgy DC Jun 06 2005 01:44 PM

Toby Borland is still bringing it with the Memphis Redbirds. Gus Bell's granddaughter misses him.

Swan Swan H Jun 06 2005 09:52 PM

Goings: Ty Wigginton sent to Indianapolis by the Pirates. Todd Greene (COL) and Roger Cedeno (StL) placed on the disabled list with strained right hamstrings.

MFS62 Jun 09 2005 04:15 PM

]Oakland Athletics - Recalled outfielder Matt Watson from Sacramento of the Pacific Coast League (AAA); Washington Nationals - optioned pitcher C.J. Nitkowski to New Orleans. Later

Edgy DC Jun 10 2005 12:20 AM

This day in 1980, the Cards fired ex-Met third basemanKen Bouyer as manager and replaced him with ex-Met executive/scout/coach Whitey Herzog.

Willets Point Jun 10 2005 12:45 AM

And the Mets paid dearly for that throughout the 1980's. Except for the Hernandez trade of course.

seawolf17 Jun 10 2005 12:20 PM

Not really an update, but a neat tidbit: Signed with New York Mets as a free agent on June 10, 1980. Signed with New York Mets as a free agent on June 9, 1990. No sense making a quiz out of this, because it's easy enough to figure out from the UMDB... but it's from [url=http://ultimatemets.com/profile.php?PlayerCode=0335]Doug Sisk[/url]'s Mets transaction history. He signed with the club almost ten years to the day from the first time he signed with them. Weird.

ScarletKnight41 Jun 10 2005 01:57 PM

Sisk came back in 1990? I have no memory of that. Then again, my oldest child was an infant at the time, so I was kind of busy. Just as well.

Edgy DC Jun 10 2005 02:12 PM

He signed with the Mets in 1990, but never appeared for them.

ScarletKnight41 Jun 10 2005 02:16 PM

OK - thanks. I'm glad to hear that I wasn't totally out of touch. Although the Dallas Green years are a major blur for me.

Yancy Street Gang Jun 10 2005 02:18 PM

What a disappointment Dallas was. When the Mets hired him, I thought he was a great choice.

Edgy DC Jun 13 2005 05:49 PM

Neil Allen returns to St. Louis and looks back, full of wist. Does anybody recall any specific reports of Allen's supposed wild nightlife? I remember him coming to the club and confessing a drinking problem, a self-diagnosis which was supposedly dismissed by the club's staff. Funny that the Cards would get such a guy while trying to dump a cokie.

TheOldMole Jun 13 2005 08:33 PM

I didn't know he was with the Yanks now...also didn't realize he'd done that well with the Cards.

seawolf17 Jun 14 2005 06:41 AM Guv'nor Al to the Pen

CHICAGO -- A day after contemplating whether to skip Al Leiter from the rotation, Marlins manager Jack McKeon made the decision official Monday. Leiter, who is 2-6 with a 6.75 ERA in 14 starts, will work out of the bullpen until most likely the Marlins' series against the Devil Rays, June 24-26. "With his experience, maybe he can help us out of the bullpen," McKeon said. The 39-year-old Leiter last threw in relief in 1993, while he was with the Blue Jays. That year, he appeared in relief 22 times and made 12 starts. Leiter has been a starter ever since, and has enjoyed an impressive career, compiling a 157-126 record. The Marlins are in position to go with a four-man rotation through the Tampa Bay series because of off-days on Thursday and June 20. Leiter's spot in the rotation was to come up Friday in Anaheim against the Angels. With the team off Thursday, Brian Moehler, who pitched Sunday, will fill in. Until Leiter later this month, the rotation from Friday on will be Moehler, Dontrelle Willis, Josh Beckett and A.J. Burnett. "I think you take life as it is," Leiter said. "The mood I'm in right now is disappointed, pitching-wise. But I can't beat myself up over it. What I can do is think of things to make me better, so that I can win games, go deeper in games, and be an asset to this franchise." In his second stint with the Marlins, Leiter was a hero on the club's 1997 World Series title team. He also threw the first no-hitter in Marlins history. After spending the past seven seasons with the Mets, Leiter signed as a free agent with the Marlins in December, accepting an $8 million contract. "Maybe it's like more of getting away from thinking about it," Leiter said of pitching in relief. "Clearing your mind. I feel fine." General manager Larry Beinfest said: "The next two weeks, we'll look at it. You know Al. He's been a big winner for a long time. He needs to work through this."

Johnny Dickshot Jun 14 2005 07:24 AM

Edgy DC wrote: Neil Allen returns to St. Louis and looks back, full of wist. Does anybody recall any specific reports of Allen's supposed wild nightlife? I remember him coming to the club and confessing a drinking problem, a self-diagnosis which was supposedly dismissed by the club's staff. . The "Tales from the Mets Dugout" book includes an interview with pitching coach Bill Monbouquette detailing Allen's flakiness, not his drinking. He was unreliable, didn't follow directions, often unprepared to work.

Elster88 Jun 14 2005 09:24 AM

Good luck in the pen, Al. I have no ill will towards him.

Edgy DC Jun 14 2005 10:11 AM

I think Whitey, no matter what he says about nobody wanting Hernandez, really liked Allen and wanted him. Allen had a real compact motion and Whitey's Cards supposedly had a lot of trouble running on the Allen/Stearns battery, which probably drove him a little nuts.

seawolf17 Jun 21 2005 07:59 AM

The Kansas City Royals recalled 1B Justin Huber from Double-A Wichita. He was hitting .332 with nine homers, 50 RBI, 50 runs scored and seven stolen bases as a 22-year-old in Double-A.

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 08:43 AM

Jose Bautista is doing alright for Altoona, but I suspect the regrettable thing about the Benson deal was not the deal itself (Wigginton/Peterson/Bautista for Benson) but the Huber-Bautista deal that set it up. That said, Huber has been repeating AA and his knee injury seems to have put his catching days on hold.

ScarletKnight41 Jun 21 2005 09:10 AM

The fact that Huber is/was an horrendous defensive catcher has to be a factor as well.

Bret Sabermetric Jun 21 2005 09:22 AM

Like the Mets don;t need a first baseman, too.

seawolf17 Jun 21 2005 09:24 AM

I was more upset about trading Huber than Kazmir at the time, actually. We'll see.

Rotblatt Jun 21 2005 10:49 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 21 2005 11:08 AM

Huber was moved to first primarily because C was blocked by John Buck. Not that he was great defensively, but most peeps seemed to think he would be able to handle catching for at least a couple of years. And losing Huber kind of got lost in the Kazmir thing, but Jesus would it be nice to have a Huber sitting in AAA right now--either as a C or a 1B. Shoppach's value has likely dropped after he couldn't hit the ball in his brief cuppa, and Boston would kill for a good relief pitcher, of which we have a few. If we could land him for, say, Hernandez or Bell, we should do it. Willie, can you pretty please get on the horn with Theo? On edit: Willie, I take that back. You get on the horn with Norfolk and tell Padilla to keep his bag packed. Omar, YOU get on the horn with Theo. Please.

seawolf17 Jun 21 2005 10:50 AM

I would trade Roberto Hernandez for Shoppach in a second. Hernandez is never going to have more value than he has right now; I said it in spring training, and I'll say it again... he's Mel Rojas II.

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 10:58 AM

Roberto Hernandez has almost nothing in common with Mel Rojas. They're both righthanded relievers with Afro-Latin heritage. It pretty much ends there.

seawolf17 Jun 21 2005 11:19 AM

My point was that when it became clear that he was going to break camp and come north, I thought he was going to be a train wreck. He's blown me away so far; but we saw a bit of what I expected when Willie overused him a few weeks ago. If Willie keeps him fresh, and he can be successful, then wonderful. I'm not expecting that to happen, though, so if they can deal him for some value, I'd say do it.

Rotblatt Jun 21 2005 11:32 AM

Oh, absolutely. Hernandez has been phenomenal for us this season, but he's old old old. If we can get a decent prospect for him, I think we should totally do it. I'd much rather move him than Loopy, honestly, but people may be gun-shy, given his track record. They may view it as "Hernandez is only good for Peterson" and not be willing to take a chance on him . . .

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 11:52 AM

Now come on. You're saying that he's like Mel Rojas because if you narrow down his performance thus far to isolated slots, he's been really bad? What comparison can't be made that way? If there was anything to that, Hernandez wouldn't be Mel Rojas II, he'd be Mel Rojas XXII. Roberto Hernandez was a forty-plus-year-old non-roster invitee New York-native who has cost the team nothing, and given the team everything they could have hoped for. He's also likely the hardest thrower in the Met pen. Mel Rojas was a very very different animal. He didn't earn a spot out of camp. He was acquired in by the Mets in a deal with a Cub team hoping to shed some salary in a very interesting trade that mostly otherwise swung the Mets way. But, as much as Wendell and McRae worked out for the Mets (compared to Mark Clark working out for the Cubs but Lance Johnson and Manny Alexander not) it probably was too much to take on. He was an expensive albatross and it took them re-acquiring Bobby Bonilla to shed his contract themselves. In a sense they're still paying for Rojas. He has since become a mythical bogeyman to invoke and scare easily frightened Met fans away from unrelated players. Roberto Hernandez? No way. Smart teams find more Roberto Hernandezes than dumb teams. Dumb teams get stuck with more Mel Rojases than smart teams. Basically, Roberto Hernandez vs Mel Rojas is evidence item one why you shouldn't commit long-term to supporting relief pitchers.

seawolf17 Jun 21 2005 11:56 AM

Edgy DC wrote: In a sense they're still paying for Rojas. He has since become a mythical bogeyman to invoke and scare easily frightened Met fans away from unrelated players. Roberto Hernandez? No way. Smart teams find more Roberto Hernandezes than dumb teams. Dumb teams get stuck with more Mel Rojases than smart teams. Basically, Roberto Hernandez vs Mel Rojas is evidence item one why you shouldn't commit long-term to supporting relief pitchers. Fair enough. And maybe I'm awfulizing a bit. And I'm not sayng he hasn't been waaaaay better than I thought he'd be. I'm just saying that he has trade value; maybe I said it in a manner that was a bit too extreme.

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 12:10 PM

Sure he has. Rojas had none, except to take on even more of an albatross in Bobby Bonilla. Eek, Bonilla. Just for fun, let's review the Rojas line. Takashi Kashiwada, Mel Rojas II Ricardo Jordan, Mel Rojas III Barry Manuel, Mel Rojas IV Toby Borland, Mel Rojas V Ricky Trlicek, Mel Rojas VI Jeff Tam, Mel Rojas VII Brad Clontz, Mel Rojas VIII Bobby M. Jones, Mel Rojas IX Allen Watson, Mel Rojas X Billy Taylor, Mel Rojas XI Dan Murray, Mel Rojas XII Dennis Springer, Mel Rojas XIII Erick Cammack, Mel Rojas XIV Jim Mann, Mel Rojas XV Dicky Gonzalez, Mel Rojas XVI Donne Freakin’ Wall, Mel Rojas XVII Tom Martin, Mel Rojas XVIII Brian Rose, Mel Rojas XIX Mark Corey, Mel Rojas XX Satoru Komiyama, Mel Rojas XXI Kane Davis, Mel Rojas XXII Pat Strange, Mel Rojas XXIII Pedro Feliciano, Mel Rojas XXIV Pete Walker, Mel Rojas XXV Jaime Cerda, Mel Rojas XVI Edwin Almonte, Mel Rojas XVII Jason Anderson, Mel Rojas XVIII

seawolf17 Jun 21 2005 12:15 PM

Most of those are a stretch; I use the Rojas analogy only because he was a pitcher who had several successful years as a closer before becoming a pariah. The list should be more like: Billy Taylor, Mel Rojas II (saved 100 games with an ERA+ in the 120s before blowing up as a Met) and that's it. I tried to add Wall, but (a) he was a good, if not solid, middle reliever for three years in San Diego, and (b) honestly wasn't that bad. And Bert isn't there yet; perhaps he never will be.

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 12:17 PM

Most of those are a huge stretch.

MFS62 Jun 21 2005 12:20 PM

Jim Mann came back more often than a boomerang. He was sent away several times, but was then re-signed to minor league contracts for no apparent reason. He reportedly had the kind of stuff that made scouts drool and got GM's fired. His name is a paean to "tools" -based scouting and his name will forever be mentioned when we think of the Oscar Henriquez Memorial Roster Spot. EDIT: I would quibble a bit (quibbles and bits?) that Dickie Gonzalez doesn't really belong on that list because unlike the others he was predominantly a starter. Later

sharpie Jun 21 2005 12:35 PM

Cerda was fine in '02, in '03 he was bad. Rojas never had a good stretch for the Mets. Free Jaime from the Rojas List!

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 12:39 PM

Neither does Allen Watson. My point really is that none of those guys belong there, but all of them belong there more Roberto Hernandez. Rojas was a unique and special individual. Nobody, not even Rich Rodriguez, has really filled his shoes.

Edgy DC Jun 21 2005 03:46 PM

Lou Gorman blows the hell out of his own horn.

Rotblatt Jun 24 2005 11:50 AM

Tearjerker about Johnny O in the Globe today. http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/06/24/growing_family/

MFS62 Jun 24 2005 12:28 PM

Rotblatt wrote: Tearjerker about Johnny O in the Globe today. http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/06/24/growing_family/ I have a good friend who works with John's dad at the U of Washington Medical Center. She had told me that the family knew from pre-natal tests that the the health of the baby, and possibly even the mother, would be in question upon delivery. As a result, John needed to be near family and friends (and his dad's hospital) during that time. This was going on at the same time John became a free agent from the Mets. At the time, he signed with the M's and said it was for "family reasons" and didn't go into detail. Since then, there have been ocasional posts on various Mets websites saying either that he "Took the money and ran" or' The Mets should have offered him more to keep him here." There is no amount of money that would have made him do that. I knew about the situation from my friend, and promised not to reveal it. But I felt bad reading those posts. I believe that I have alluded to it here. Maybe everyone will understand now that this has become public. Later

Edgy DC Jun 24 2005 12:44 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jun 24 2005 12:54 PM

I think all except the willful reactionarys got the idea. Though, when I was vistiting congress for the contraction hearing, Anthony "The Wiener Man" Wiener opened his comments and questions by essaying on his longtime baseball (Mets) fandom and stating, "I still don't understand what happened with John Olerud." "Let it go, Tony!" I shouted from the gallery.

MFS62 Jun 24 2005 12:50 PM

Its better than when I had to present to HCFA (the Health Care Financing Administration) and a member of the panel to whom I was presenting said. "I see you're from New York. Well, I'm a Cubs fan." Later

Rotblatt Jun 24 2005 12:51 PM

Yeah, it definitely casts some light on his departure. I had thought that management didn't do enough to keep him here, and it's now clear that nothing would have been enough. He's a great guy who was fabolous for us and a player I really enjoyed rooting for. Someone I couldn't help but root for a little even with the MFY, as a matter of fact. Thankfully, that conflict of interest is now past, and I can root for him with abandon . . . Best wishes, John, and good luck.

PatchyFogg Jun 24 2005 02:34 PM

]He wasn't sure if his career was over until the Yankees contacted him about a week later. He didn't want to leave his hometown, but he had little choice. Sometimes human interest stories go a little too far, like here. He was still gettting paid the remaining millions on his deal and was free to be at home in Seattle 24/7. Why pack up the accoutrements and head East?

Edgy DC Jun 24 2005 02:43 PM

Did the Yankees pick up his Seattle contract, or let him clear waivers and sign him to another deal? I don't recall. Because I think if they picked up his Seattle deal, he would be forced to report or forfeit his salary.

Johnny Dickshot Jun 24 2005 03:00 PM

As I recall it, they let him clear first. Nobody wanted that deal. I hate to say it, but it was great when he was too injured to help the MFYs avoid their ultimate humiliation last ALCS. You know if he was in there, he gets at least one big hit in 4 games.

Edgy DC Jun 24 2005 03:14 PM

So the Yankee trainers apparently missed a diagnosis on both Heredia and Olerud. Bad year. I'm not saying the Met staff can be shown to be be superior, certainly not in 2004, where their inablitiy to rehabilitate their injured players hurt the team at many levels. But bad year.

Rotblatt Jun 24 2005 11:42 PM

Huber with his first major league hit--a pinch hit one-run double for KC. Congratulations, Justin!

seawolf17 Jun 26 2005 07:41 PM

The St. Louis Cardinals activated outfielder Roger Cedeno from the 15-day disabled list Friday night, and then designated him for assignment. Cedeno was batting .158 in 57 at-bats with eight RBIs, five of them as a pinch hitter. He had been on the DL since June 6 with a strained hamstring.

Edgy DC Jun 29 2005 11:01 PM

I'm sure you'll see the film at eleven, especially if you tune in to your CBS affilliate, but apparently ex-Met Kenny Rogers, who'd been having a fine year at 40 years old, went completely bonkers and started shoving cameramen around for gettting in his face, cursing and smashing, gnashing teeth and all. Supposedly, KTVT in Dallas has it all. Somebody ended up going to the hospital.

metirish Jun 29 2005 11:17 PM

Just saw it on MSG, Rogers went nuts, cameraman ended up in hospital in "a lot of pain", Rodgers was sent home and the Cops were called..

metirish Jun 30 2005 12:05 AM

Looks like Stanton has pitched his last game for the MFY..from the NYT today.. ]Quantrill and Stanton shook hands and exchanged hugs with teammates and club personnel after Wednesday night's rainout at Camden Yards. Quantrill would not comment after leaving the clubhouse, and Stanton said, "You can read between the lines."

MFS62 Jun 30 2005 07:24 AM

Is the guy named Kelly playing centerfield for one of the west coast teams the same guy the Mets had at Norfolk last year? IIRC he was an ex-Pac10 football player. Later

seawolf17 Jun 30 2005 07:41 AM

He's a Red... Kenny Kelly, and yes, he was a Met farmhand for a bit. I do remember that he was a FB player, but I don't remember the position or the school (Miami?).

MFS62 Jun 30 2005 08:22 AM

Click, the light went on. Thanks. Yes, I think I remember reading that he was a quarterback for Miami U. He didn't play baseball until late in his HS stay, and he had great skills, but not refined yet. Later

Rotblatt Jun 30 2005 09:55 AM

I think he was a kicker.

MFS62 Jun 30 2005 10:20 AM

Can't be. everyone knows kickers don't have any athletic skills. :) Later

TheOldMole Jun 30 2005 11:10 AM

Bad fit: Stanton about to be released by Yanks.

seawolf17 Jun 30 2005 01:44 PM

Hey! I know someone who can be a spare outfielder for us! The St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports that Roger Cedeno, designated for assignment last week, was placed on release waivers by the Cardinals Wednesday. Just kidding. Maybe if we bring back Rickey and Roger...

Elster88 Jun 30 2005 01:50 PM

TheOldMole wrote: Stanton about to be released by Yanks. Careful who's name you invoke. CookieMom's soap tastes awful, I can tell you.

MFS62 Jul 07 2005 09:56 AM

O one-liner in this morning's NY Daily News reports that Grant Roberts signs with the Yanks' Trenton team of the Eastern League. Later

metirish Jul 07 2005 12:11 PM

J Phillips hit a 3 run homer last night, LA won 9/5

MFS62 Jul 07 2005 04:51 PM

Jay Payton DFA'd by the Bosox. He says he wants to start, but if he clears waivers, the team thatpicks him up only has to pay the prorated major league minimum for the rest of the season and the Sawks pick up the rest of his $3.5 million contract. Dare we? Isn't he better than G. Williams? Thoughts? Later

Elster88 Jul 07 2005 04:54 PM

I'm down, then I could wear my Payton jersey back to Shea again with his old number. But I do that anyway.

seawolf17 Jul 07 2005 04:55 PM

Bleh. Loved Payton as a prospect back in the day, but he's past his usefulness now. I don't know that he gives us anything we don't already have.

MFS62 Jul 07 2005 04:58 PM

seawolf17 wrote: I don't know that he gives us anything we don't already have. A backup outfielder under the age of 50? Later

Rotblatt Jul 07 2005 05:11 PM

He's better than Williams but he was released because he wants to start. I bet he'll sign with a CFer-less team who will start him . . .

Johnny Dickshot Jul 07 2005 06:04 PM

Speculation on SoSH and elsewhere is that a trade has been worked out, and Payton goes to Oakland for relief pitching. If Payton wants to start, as he's said, maybe this means Oakland trades Kotsay to the MFY as threatened. Then again, the Bosox may be risking helping the MFYs too much here.

MFS62 Jul 07 2005 08:32 PM

Johnny, that sounds logical. But when did logic ever come into play when both the Yankees and Red Sox are involved? Usually, they're trying to put one over on each other like an episode of Spy VS Spy. Later

Johnny Dickshot Jul 08 2005 08:16 AM

Payton's new place will be Oakland As the result of a confrontation with manager Terry Francona, the Red Sox have designated outfielder Jay Payton for assignment and will trade him to the A's for reliever Chad Bradford. 01:00 AM EDT on Friday, July 8, 2005 BY SEAN McADAM Journal Sports Writer BALTIMORE -- After a late-inning dugout confrontation with manager Terry Francona Wednesday night forced their hand, the Red Sox designated outfielder Jay Payton for assignment yesterday and have a deal in place to send him to the Oakland A's for reliever Chad Bradford. Because Bradford, who underwent back surgery in the spring, is currently on the disabled list, the trade can't be announced until the All-Star break, when the veteran reliever, currently on a rehab assignment, is activated. According to multiple industry sources, the Sox had the deal in place and were waiting for Bradford to be activated. But Payton's actions Wednesday night at Texas' Ameriquest Field hastened his departure. Payton's unhappiness has been well documented ever since he went public with his desire to be traded last month, and the Sox have been attempting to meet his request. When Payton verbally jousted with Francona Wednesday night, his fate was sealed. Payton and John Olerud were inserted as defensive replacements in the bottom of the seventh, with Payton taking over for Johnny Damon in center and Olerud replacing Kevin Millar at first. But when Payton learned that he would hit sixth -- in Millar's spot -- and Olerud would hit leadoff -- in Damon's spot -- he erupted, several sources said, claiming that this signified a lack of confidence in his ability as a hitter. In reality, Francona wanted to avoid having the left-handed-hitting Olerud bat immediately after another lefty, Trot Nixon, the fifth hitter. Such an alignment would have made it easier for Rangers manager Buck Showalter to bring in a lefty reliever to face consecutive hitters. A miffed Payton angrily shouted: "That's it -- I'm out of here." Indeed, he was. Immediately after the game, Payton was told he was being designated for assignment, and instead of flying on the team charter to Baltimore, was told to return to Boston yesterday morning and await word on his fate. Francona would not confirm or deny the Wednesday night incident other than to say yesterday: "Jay was having a very difficult time handling his (backup) role. He was a pretty good player when he played, but it was a challenge for him to (fill) that role. At times, it was very frustrating for him and hard for him to hide that frustration . . . It was time to move on." One Red Sox player said yesterday that Payton's constant carping about insufficient playing time had gotten much worse in the last week and had angered many of his teammates. Payton was obtained from San Diego along with Ramon Vazquez -- ironically, also dealt by the Sox yesterday in a separate transaction -- for ALCS hero Dave Roberts. Payton appeared in 55 games for the Sox, hitting .263 with five homers and 21 RBI. Bradford, 32, made a rehab appearance Tuesday night for Class A Stockton, having spent time on the 60-day DL. The submarining right-hander, who has spent parts of seven seasons in the major leagues, enjoyed his best year in 2003, when he went 7-4 in 72 games for the A's, compiling a 3.04 E.R.A. Last season, he pitched in 68 games, going 5-6 with 4.42 E.R.A. His sinking fastball generates lots of ground balls, and the Sox believe he can help them in the sixth and seventh innings. Payton is in the final year of a deal that pays him $2.75 million. It's believed the Sox will send some of the $2.6 million they received from San Diego last December to Oakland to help facilitate the trade. With Payton gone and no backup outfielder on the roster, the Red Sox yesterday summoned Rule V selection Adam Stern from Pawtucket. Stern, who missed most of spring training because of a broken thumb and then missed additional time with a pulled hamstring, started in place of Damon in center field last night. Stern, who was staying in a Pawtucket hotel while on his injury rehab assignment with the PawSox, had his cell phone turned off as team manager Ron Johnson frantically tried to reach him yesterday morning to tell him of his promotion. Eventually, the club had a hotel employee go to his room and knock on his door. "I packed up real quick," said Stern. He was surprised to find that he would be in the lineup immediately, a situation made necessary by Damon's aching right shoulder. "It caught me off guard a little bit," said Stern. "It will be nice to play in a game (right away). I'll just get (his major-league debut) out of the way and not think too much about it." As a Rule V pick, Stern must stay on the major-league roster all season. If not, he would then be placed on waivers and offered back to the Atlanta Braves, from whom the Sox drafted him last December. "All I can do is play," he said. "Someone else makes those decisions." Francona said Stern "definitely throws very well. He has a strong arm and knows how to throw. He can play all three outfield positions and he's very good defensively. The adjustment to major-league pitching is always a question mark. "This will be a test for him, but I think he can help us win games because of his glove and his baserunning."

seawolf17 Jul 08 2005 08:37 AM

I love Chad Bradford. Great trade for the Sox. (Interesting that Beane gave him up, considering he's a big star in Moneyball.)

Elster88 Jul 08 2005 08:46 AM

Those draft/trade/assignment rules are confusing.

Edgy DC Jul 08 2005 09:31 AM

PAYTON! PAY - TON! They paid you a ton To sit on your bun You bitched. Now you'll miss all the Fun!

soupcan Jul 08 2005 10:11 AM

I don't recall Payton being anything other than a good soilder his whole career. Finally he hooks up with a good, winning team, produces when he gets to play, seemingly is an important contributor. If he has a good year he probably cashes in at the end - Ah-ha, that's prolly what it was - Jay wants more pt which could translate into a better contract for him in the off-season. Sly devil that Satan.

cooby Jul 08 2005 10:14 AM

As fond as I was of Payton as a Met, I am always newly surprised when I see him playing for Boston. I just can't get it through my head.

ScarletKnight41 Jul 08 2005 10:23 AM

Bradford is in the process of rehabbing from an arm injury. I'm guessing that Beane isn't counting on him to be effective for a while.

Rotblatt Jul 08 2005 11:00 AM

If Stern adjusts to major league hitting and Bradford can get healthy enough to duplicate his 04 stats, this is a pretty good trade, but that's a whole lot of ifs . . . Someone's going to need to spell Damon in CF, and if I'm Francona, I'd much rather have Payton doing it than Stern, but maybe Stern will adjust well. He seems like he could be a decent role player . . . On a related note, their lineup last night sucked. No Tek, Manny, Damon or Renteria. It's like they wanted to spot Baltimore a game or something.

seawolf17 Jul 08 2005 11:06 AM

I didn't realize Bradford was hurt. That would 'splain it.

duan Jul 09 2005 04:40 PM todd zeile

is making his fox debut, at the game between the cards & giants

MFS62 Jul 13 2005 03:51 PM

DC area folks, I just heard from a friend in the DC area thatthe O's have signed (or are about to sign) Mike Stanton. Have you heard anything about that yet? Later

PatchyFogg Jul 13 2005 04:03 PM

Stanton exercised his no-trade clause when he was with both the Mets and Yanks because he didn't want to leave his Westchester home. I guess he's going to be taking the Shuttle a lot.

ScarletKnight41 Jul 13 2005 04:32 PM

[url=http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8565364/]Reject Yankee Scum Lands In DC[/url] It's not hard to confirm these things - all you have to do is a Google news search with the guy's name.

MFS62 Jul 13 2005 04:42 PM

I rushed over here in a spate of breathless enthusiasm as soon as I heard the news. Didn't have time for a Google experience. Later

sharpie Jul 14 2005 05:23 PM

Al Leiter DFA'd by the Marlins. This might be it for Al.

Edgy DC Jul 14 2005 05:30 PM

WOWBOBWOW! Omar looking smart. Will the Yankees bite? A lot of ex-Met pitchers floating around in the ether right now, waiting for a call from a desperate team.

sharpie Jul 14 2005 05:32 PM

Good point, 'specially with Wang, Pavano and Wright on the DL.

seawolf17 Jul 14 2005 08:42 PM

Can we trick the Yanks into taking Ishii and Glavine too?

Edgy DC Jul 18 2005 07:43 PM

"Never again, well maybe once more."

Elster88 Jul 19 2005 09:06 AM

On the radio this morning they acted like Kenny had smacked around another camerman, saying "He did it again" over and over to try to sucker people into staying through the commercials. Talking trash to a cameraman is no big deal, IMHO.

Edgy DC Jul 19 2005 09:17 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Jul 22 2005 05:02 PM

Yabbut, threatening one while you're heading to jail for making good on your threat to others is news.

ScarletKnight41 Jul 22 2005 04:29 PM

[url=http://oakland.athletics.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/gameday_recap.jsp?ymd=20050721&content_id=1139916&vkey=recap&fext=.jsp&c_id=oak]Jay Payton Is Feeling The Love in Oakland[/url]

Johnny Dickshot Jul 22 2005 04:37 PM

I wondered how he was gonna do there -- coming with a"I-in-Team" rep and replacing a popular player. One of the great pleasures of being a Met fan in the late 90s/early 00s was the rare but exciting Jay Payton Hot Streak.

OlerudOwned Jul 23 2005 03:29 PM

The world famous Pedro Astacio starting today for the Pads. I didnt even notice Texas had waived him.

Johnny Dickshot Jul 29 2005 01:39 PM

Pete Walker gets the win in a historic game in Toronto: [url]http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20050729.wxjayz29/BNStory/Sports/[/url]

OlerudOwned Jul 31 2005 06:30 PM

Mr. John Olerud has been red hot lately for the Red Sox, and added a homer today in Boston's win vs. the Twins.

Valadius Jul 31 2005 08:54 PM

Dan Wheeler took the loss for the 'Stros against our Metsies today.

DocTee Jul 31 2005 11:07 PM

Marco Scutaro getting some time on LF for the A's (and he delivered the game-winning hit in Wednesday's come-from-behind victory vs the Tribe)

Edgy DC Aug 01 2005 03:53 PM

Mike Bordick has been inducted into the Maine Baseball Hall of Fame. Bordick is a rarity not only for being a major leaguer (and a very successful one at that) who came from the US northern border, but also one who was originally signed after attending a tryout camp.

TheOldMole Aug 01 2005 08:47 PM

Carlton Willey was from Maine.

G-Fafif Aug 04 2005 03:21 PM

Roberto Petagine walked in the middle of a big Red Sox rally and scored on Varitek's grand slam. Roberto Petagine's on the Red Sox?

Rotblatt Aug 04 2005 03:26 PM

They signed him in the offseason as 1B backup and shipped him down to Pawtucket, where he's been hitting the snot out of the ball. He's got something like a 1.100 OPS down there. They decided to call up Johnny O instead of him because he had some sort of foot problem when they had an opening and he wasn't able to man first. Then Johnny got hot and blocked Petagine until getting put on the DL today with a hammy problem. His first shot at the bigs in I don't know how long and he gets to bat cleanup for the defending world champions. Not bad.

MFS62 Aug 04 2005 03:45 PM

The feelgood movie "The Roberto Petagine Story" produced by Disney Filems. Coming soon, to a theater near you. Later

G-Fafif Aug 04 2005 03:56 PM

Brady Clark's doing pretty well for himself these days.

Rotblatt Aug 04 2005 04:01 PM

Motherfucker. Willie, figure out how to use our pen, for the love of Christ.

Rotblatt Aug 04 2005 04:07 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 04 2005 04:14 PM

Wrong thread.

Edgy DC Aug 04 2005 04:08 PM

The threads are getting cross-contaminated, just like Rafael Pameiro's nutiritional supplements.

Rotblatt Aug 04 2005 04:14 PM

oops Sorry about that!

Edgy DC Aug 08 2005 05:00 PM

Alberto Castillo is designated for assignment, two RBI short of 100 for his career.

MFS62 Aug 08 2005 05:25 PM

And wasn't that our old pal Pete Walker with another victory over the MFYs this [ast weekend? (See post at the top of this page) Later

seawolf17 Aug 09 2005 10:26 AM

More ex-Mets move north, as Ricky Bottalico joins Olerud and Petagine as he signs a minor-league deal with the Red Sox. And hey! I'm Ricky Bottalico! Weird.

MFS62 Aug 09 2005 03:21 PM

Theo's collecting ex-Mets from a time long, long ago: Red Sox acquired LHP Mike Remlinger and cash from the Cubs for RHP Olivo Astacio. Later

Elster88 Aug 09 2005 04:17 PM

Maybe that there GM does know what he's doing Payton, Jay (for Oakland) 19 G, 80 AB, 13 R, 24 H, 3 2B, 6 HR, 19 RBI, 3 BB, 14 SO, .300 AVG, .321 OBP, .563 SLG

Edgy DC Aug 09 2005 05:00 PM

Met fans who idolize the GMs of Oakland and Boston must've really been conflicted when that trade went down. The Mets really helped Oakland turn it around this year. But didn't they?

Edgy DC Aug 10 2005 03:19 PM

The Standard Times (CT) catches up with the Mookster. The Signal (Santa Clarita, CA) catches up with the Toddster.

Willets Point Aug 10 2005 03:24 PM

A whole lot of nothing in that article, but it's Mookie so it doesn't matter.

Johnny Dickshot Aug 10 2005 04:25 PM

The Zeile piece is overwritten and has a few minor errors but I liked it

Edgy DC Aug 11 2005 12:47 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Aug 12 2005 02:06 PM

Vance Gets His Chance (Detroit News) So Does Perlozzo (But He'll Miss HIs Mazz) (Fox Sports) [url=http://philadelphia.phillies.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20050806&content_id=1160530&vkey=news_phi&fext=.jsp&c_id=phi]More PT for Pratt, Also[/url] (MLB.com) Good Time to be Dan Wheeler, I Tell You What (Warwick [RI] Beacon) Long, interesting, but mostly un-Metly article from the Philadelphia CityPaper with a lot of good Del Unser material about two thirds of the way down Athletics Push Scutaro to Outfield (San Francisco Chronicle)

Edgy DC Aug 12 2005 01:42 PM

Catching up with the Dudester (not much from the Bluefield Daily Telegraph, but still)

Johnny Dickshot Aug 12 2005 01:58 PM

The Del Unser article was excellent (not for the Del-ness).

ScarletKnight41 Aug 13 2005 08:28 PM

Jay Payton's 3-run home run was the difference in Oakland's 5-2 victory over Minnesota, a win that keeps the A's in a first place tie with the Angels.

ScarletKnight41 Aug 14 2005 10:05 PM

Matt Watson is back in the majors, coming up while Oakland puts Nick Swisher on the bereavement list due to his grandmother's death.

MFS62 Aug 15 2005 07:44 AM

Did I miss in anther thread that old pal Wilson Delgado tested positive for steroids for the second time this year in the minors? He is the first to swallow the 30 game suspension pill. Later

Rotblatt Aug 16 2005 10:51 AM Strickland!

Scotty Strickland's finally pitching again! I had stopped checking out Round Rock's stats for a while, since he had apparently tweaked something, but he's now thrown 11 innings and is looking pretty dominant: 11 IP, 2.45 ERA, 0.73 WHIP, 13 K, 2 BB, 2 HR, 10.64 K/9, 1.64 BB/9, 1.63 HR/9. I'm done being pissed about letting him go, since it looks like he was injured when we kicked him to the curb, but I'm happy to see him back and contributing.

seawolf17 Aug 16 2005 10:52 AM

If Scott Strickland and Dan Wheeler help the Astros ice down a playoff spot in September, I'm going to be sad.

seawolf17 Aug 17 2005 09:31 AM

Former Met-turned-movie magnate Todd Zeile stopped by Shea Stadium on Tuesday, promoting his soon-to-be-released movie, "Dirty Deeds." The teen movie co-stars Milo Ventimiglia (Gilmore Girls, Bedford Diaries) and Zoe Saldana (Drum Line, Pirates of the Caribbean) -- both of whom were also at Shea -- and is slated for an Aug. 26 release. The first venture of Zeile's Green Diamond Entertainment company, "Dirty Deeds" was funded with the help of former teammates Mike Piazza, Cliff Floyd, Tom Glavine, Robin Ventura, Al Leiter and Jason Giambi. As for Zeile, who has a small role in the film as a street bum named "Mullet" -- the scene was filmed during the Mets' visit to Los Angeles last year -- he is enjoying his post-retirement life away from baseball and maintaining his distance. "I don't follow it a whole lot, as far as the individual themes," Zeile said. "I miss the three hours on the field." [url]http://www.dirtydeedsthemovie.net[/url]

MFS62 Aug 17 2005 09:48 AM

Another esample of a player not knowing what he was taking? Todd Hundley: http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/chi-0508160239aug16,1,2087946.story?coll=chi-sportscubs-hed&ctrack=1&cset=true Later

TheOldMole Aug 17 2005 12:30 PM

Individual themes???? or individual teams???

seawolf17 Aug 17 2005 08:21 PM

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2136760]Davey[/url]'s back in the dugout, managing the team of minor leaguers that will represent the United States in the 2005 IBAF World Cup in The Netherlands beginning Sept. 2.

Edgy DC Aug 19 2005 10:34 AM

Gibbons ♥ Wilson. [url=http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20050818&content_id=1174931&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]Gus Bell and his Descendency[/url].

MFS62 Aug 23 2005 09:39 AM

Alberto Castillo had second thoughts about signing with Norfolk and has signed with the Oakland organization. Later

seawolf17 Aug 23 2005 09:42 AM

[url=http://www.oursportscentral.com/services/releases/?id=3213764]Ty Wigginton[/url] is back, replacing the injured Jose Castillo. Wigs was recently named the International League's Batter of the Week for the period of Aug. 15-21. He hit .519 (14-for-27) with three homers, eight RBI, 11 runs and a .926 slugging percentage during the week.

Johnny Dickshot Aug 23 2005 12:00 PM

Timo's ganny panties from the Chicago Tribune: This (superstitious) behavior came to mind Sunday, when White Sox outfielder Timo Perez went to unusual lengths to try to help the team end a season-worst seven-game losing streak. Perez decided to hang a pair of women's black panties—"extra wide" black panties—in the Sox's clubhouse at U.S. Cellular Field. The Sox went out and ended their streak with a 6-2 victory over the Yankees. Perez wasn't around to discuss the, well … unmentionables, but teammate Aaron Rowand did. "We had the 'Rally Panties' up today," Rowand said. "A woman's undergarment—a large undergarment—was our rallying flag." So while the Angels had their "Rally Monkey" in their 2002 World Series championship season, the innovative Sox offer up "Rally Panties." Whatever works, I suppose.

MFS62 Aug 23 2005 12:06 PM

After game 1 of the Y2K world Series, Mets fans would have hung Timo. Later

metirish Aug 23 2005 01:15 PM

Gooden in trouble again Former Mets, Yanks pitcher wanted after leaving scene of traffic stop for drunk driving THE ASSOCIATED PRESS August 23, 2005, 12:56 PM EDT TAMPA, Fla. -- Former baseball star Dwight Gooden was being sought by police Tuesday on a felony warrant after he allegedly drove away from an officer who stopped him on suspicion of drunken driving. Gooden, 41, left the scene of the traffic stop early Monday after refusing to get out his 2004 BMW to take a field sobriety test, police spokeswoman Laura McElroy said. The officer stopped Gooden's car because he was weaving in traffic near downtown Tampa, McElroy said. Gooden, a Tampa native and resident, has a history of drug abuse and is awaiting trial on a domestic violence charge. "The officer pulls over the car and immediately notices that the driver is under the influence," she said. "He has bloodshot, glassy eyes, his speech his slurred and he has a strong odor of alcohol." Gooden handed the officer his driver's license but refused two requests to get out of the car, McElroy said. He then drove off with the officer still holding his license. Police chose not pursue for safety reasons, McElroy said, but went to his two known addresses to look for him. They also contacted his most recent employer, the New York Yankees, and his mother, she said. Yankees spokesman Howard Grosswirth said Tuesday that Gooden hasn't worked for the team as a special adviser since April and officials don't know his whereabouts. Gooden, who was out of jail on bail after a March domestic violence arrest, is wanted on felony charges of DUI and fleeing police, and a misdemeanor charge of resisting arrest without violence. "At this point he is in a lot of trouble, and the only way he can help himself is to come forward and take responsibility for his actions," McElroy said. Gooden, the 1984 Rookie of the Year and the 1985 NL Cy Young Award winner while with the New York Mets, went 194-112 with a 3.51 ERA before retiring in 2001. He also pitched for the Yankees, Cleveland Indians, Houston Astros and Tampa Bay Devil Rays. Gooden was arrested by Tampa police in 2002 on a drunken driving charge, but later pleaded guilty to reckless driving and received a year probation. He was arrested in March and charged with hitting his live-in girlfriend in the face during an argument. He was charged with misdemeanor domestic battery, and the case is pending. A call to Peter Hobson, the attorney representing Gooden in the domestic violence case, was not immediately returned Tuesday. During his playing days, Gooden was suspended for 60 days in 1994 for testing positive for cocaine while with the Mets. He tested positive for cocaine again while on suspension and was sidelined for the 1995 season. Earlier this month his son, Dwight Gooden Jr., 19, was jailed for violating his probation for cocaine possession. Police said they found marijuana and bullets in the younger Gooden's vehicle parked outside a nightclub. Gooden's disappearance is reminiscent of the 2001 disappearance of his friend and former teammate Darryl Strawberry, who was missing for four days after he walked away from a drug treatment center where he was under house arrest.

DocTee Aug 23 2005 10:07 PM

Jeff Kent revealed to be Yankee stadium usher in past life....Milton Bradley accuses him of being insensitive to persons of color. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2141482

Valadius Aug 24 2005 08:04 PM

Two hotheads clashing... that was inevitable.

MFS62 Aug 24 2005 08:17 PM

On today's radio show, Michael Kay said there have been stories of Kent being a hothead and not liked by teammates. But my view is that so far the only two clashes he has had, that we know about, have been with Bradley and Bonds - two players who don't get along with anybody. The jury on Kent is still out in my mind. Later Edit: Typos

DocTee Aug 24 2005 11:00 PM

In Kent's defense... any guy who supports womens college athletics ($100 per HR to UC Berkeley softball during his time with the Giants) is OK in my book

Valadius Aug 25 2005 08:23 PM

Scott Kazmir got knocked out of the game tonight after only 2.1 innings, giving up 8 hits and 8 earned runs.

Edgy DC Aug 29 2005 12:55 AM

Rusty F. Greer stumbles into a doping story. These are more fun with long-lost guys like Greer, but... Tiberius Wigginton named International League Player of the Week. Preston Wilson profiled in The Washington Post.

Rotblatt Aug 30 2005 04:46 PM Re: Strickland!

Strickland's thrown another 7 innings in the last 14 days and he last pitched on August 28. Over that time, he's posted the following line: 3.00 ERA, 0.71 WHIP, 6 K, 1 BB, 0 HR. His new Round Rock totals: 2.50 ERA, 0.72 WHIP, 9.5 K/9, 1.5 BB/9, 6.33 K/BB, 1.0 HR/9. And he's got 10 saves. He has to get called up by the end of the day tomorrow to make the post-season roster. He'd probably be better than Burns or Wandy Rodriguez but they need Rodriguez to start, I think, and Burns is younger with some upsied, although he's sucked this month. They have a pretty tight pen over there and I wouldn't be too surprised if he didn't get called up until the rosters expand. Too bad. I'm rooting for him to get back to the bigs . . .

Yancy Street Gang Aug 30 2005 04:53 PM

Valadius wrote: Scott Kazmir got knocked out of the game tonight after only 2.1 innings, giving up 8 hits and 8 earned runs. The only reason the Devil Rays keep starting him is to try to justify the Victor Zambrano trade to their fans.

Willets Point Aug 30 2005 05:34 PM

Kazmir pitches again tonight. BTW, every time I see this thread it makes me miss Swan Swan H (aka gf21212212121). Where is he now?

Rotblatt Aug 31 2005 04:44 PM

Huber, who won the MVP Award in the Futures Game this year, is batting .277/.364/.500/.864 in 94 AAA at bats after going .339/.426/.565/.991 OPS in 336 AA at bats. He is expected to receive a September call-up and displace Joe McEwing (.585 OPS) at first base for the Royals. Psst. Hey, Sal! Complaining about losing Huber might get you farther than Wiggy!

Rotblatt Aug 31 2005 04:44 PM Edited 2 time(s), most recently on Aug 31 2005 04:52 PM

Duplicate Post. While I'm at it, though, here are Petersons numbers so far for the Altoona Curve (AA) 10-9, 5.79 ERA, 1.47 WHIP, 135.1 IP, 152 H, 100 R, 86 ER, 19 HR, 72 BB, 81 K. He's actually been pitching better recently, however--his ERA was at 7.00 on June 2.

Willets Point Sep 01 2005 08:48 PM

John Olerud has two home runs and all five runs batted in for the Red Sox in their 5-4 lead over Tampa Bay tonight.

Valadius Sep 02 2005 12:34 AM

He ended up with two homers and 6 RBIs.

seawolf17 Sep 02 2005 04:14 PM

Going to see the LI Ducks and Newark Bears tonight and tomorrow, so... Chris Jones was hired as manager of the Newark Bears in November of 2004, becoming the fourth skipper in franchise history. He follows in the footsteps of Tom O’Malley (1998-2001), Marv Foley (2002) and Bill Madlock (2003-2004) in becoming the field boss of the Bears. The 39 year old Jones is a familiar name to Bears fans as he spent the 2004 season playing in Newark. Jones appeared in 79 games with the Bears and hit 15 home runs, drove in 69 runs and was tied for 8th in the Atlantic League batting race with a .313 average last season. At the conclusion of the ’04 campaign Jones retired as a player after having played 21 seasons in professional baseball. Highly respected by his peers for his teaching and leadership skills, Jones was highly sought after for coaching positions following the 2004 season. He decided to accept the Bears managerial position to build on what he accomplished as a player in Newark last season. Originally a 3rd round selection of the Cincinnati Reds out of Liverpool High School in upstate New York in 1984, Jones played for eleven different organizations in his career. He broke into the major leagues in 1991 with the Reds, batting .292 in 89 at-bats that season. In all Jones played in 548 career major league games, for 8 different big league teams, and batted .252 with 30 home runs and 131 RBI. Jones spent two seasons playing for the New York Mets in 1995 and 1996. He hit a career-high 8 home runs for the Mets in ’95 while batting .280 with 31 runs batted in. Jones also played in the majors with the Houston Astros, Colorado Rockies, San Diego Padres, Arizona Diamondbacks, San Francisco Giants and Milwaukee Brewers.

Valadius Sep 03 2005 10:27 PM

Jason Tyner was the DH and batted 2nd for the Twins tonight. He went 0 for 4.

Edgy DC Sep 04 2005 09:28 PM

Bud Harrelson empties his rolodex for autism night. Let's hope Rocky can make it this year.

mlbaseballtalk Sep 04 2005 09:59 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Tiberius Wigginton named International League Player of the Week. And people said "No ya can't give up him for anything" :roll: I think he and Hundley were probably the most overatted in terms of popularity overweighing A) actual production and B) the overall value of the guy who replaced them Can't put Alfonzo in with them because, well since he left 2B has been a severe black hole (and even 3rd in some ways can be called a black hole from the point he was moved till David Wright debuted) Steve

Edgy DC Sep 04 2005 10:20 PM

]And people said "No ya can't give up him for anything" I don't think too many peeps said that.

mlbaseballtalk Sep 04 2005 10:27 PM

Edgy DC wrote: ]And people said "No ya can't give up him for anything" I don't think too many peeps said that. True maybe not here, but listening to WFAN and 1050ESPN Radio last couple of years and you'd thought that Wigginton was the second coming of Pete Rose :roll:

Edgy DC Sep 06 2005 09:31 AM

Bobby Bonilla inducted into the Hall of Fame. Matt Lawton is the 93rd player to play for both the Mets and the Yankees. Scarlet may have mentioned it, but the A's called up Alberto Castillo and Matt Watson from Sacramento with the start of September.

Elster88 Sep 06 2005 09:43 AM

That link caused about ten pop up windows. _____________________________ This post was made under the designation 163) Charlie Neal

Edgy DC Sep 06 2005 09:59 AM

Yeah, that site stanks that way. I hit refresh and the article re-loads without the popups. But it's not exactly Pulitzer stuff, to tell you the truth. You missed a good analogy opportunity there, though. You could have said, "I haven't seen so many popups since Joe Orsulak in 1993."

Frayed Knot Sep 06 2005 12:08 PM

Bob L. (Gemeinweiser) Miller http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/not-just-any-bob-miller/

seawolf17 Sep 06 2005 03:38 PM

Ex-Met draft pick [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2153470]Lloyd McClendon [/url]was given his walking papers by the Pirates today.

MFS62 Sep 06 2005 03:47 PM

Even John McGraw couldn't have won with that roster. Later

Vic Sage Sep 06 2005 04:14 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 06 2005 04:20 PM

5 straight 90-loss seasons is enough rope for any manager and enough patience for any owner. on edit: and furthermore, the Pirates' roster should be a wet dream for the "play the prospects" crowd. Their lineup is replete with talented youngsters. Why is that a roster thats destined to lose in Pittsburgh, yet one that we should institute here at Shea?

Elster88 Sep 06 2005 04:14 PM

seawolf17 wrote: Ex-Met draft pick [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2153470]Lloyd McClendon [/url]was given his walking papers by the Pirates today. He will always be remembered for taking first base with him when he was ejected. For me that beats out Bobby V's disguise. _____________________________ This post was made under the designation 163) Charlie Neal

Edgy DC Sep 06 2005 04:24 PM

Damned if I didn't have a similar biography of Miller in the hopper. I liked McClendon, a badass to the last. It's getting to be that anybody well-positioned to start off on a potentially long managerial career (a Randolph-type situation) would decline an offer from a team such as Pittsburgh or Kansas City. The ones who'd be inclined to take such jobs are the ones unlikely to ever get another offer. (Anybody ever see McClendon's interim replacement, Pete Mackanin, on the short list of future managers?) On the other hand, local hero Tony Peńa, might be a direction the Pirates look in.

MFS62 Sep 06 2005 04:35 PM

Vic Sage wrote: on edit: and furthermore, the Pirates' roster should be a wet dream for the "play the prospects" crowd. Their lineup is replete with talented youngsters. Why is that a roster thats destined to lose in Pittsburgh, yet one that we should institute here at Shea? Vic, I don't think anyone has suggested a "Logan's Run" kind of approach, where anyone over 30 should be discarded (killed in the movie). But I sense the frustration of those who want to introduce young player to the 25 man roster, and then play them in meanngful situations. They see the team adding a bunch of has-beens or never-wases at the expense of giving younger players (and pitchers) a chance to prove/ disprove that they belong. Why do the Mets do it? Maybe because there are no major league ready players in the system. Maybe its because they have the money to spend on veteran talent. Maybe because they have heard that "New York Fans won't support a team during a rebuilding year." I dunno. And why have the PIrates exceusively played youngsters? Maybe because they don't have the money to spend on acquiring/ retaining veterans. But I don't think there's anybody here who believes that this is an either/ or situation. Later

Johnny Dickshot Sep 06 2005 04:45 PM

My impression was that although the 1962 Mets liked Miller's ability they did not like how he handled himself. That was a bad trade as it turned out

Edgy DC Sep 06 2005 05:28 PM

Davey Johnson gets game from Lastings Milledge. A nice one: Jack Aker is available to give your little guy private baseball lessons.

Valadius Sep 06 2005 10:04 PM

Glendon Rusch is pitching a one-hitter for the Cubs against the Cards tonight.

Rotblatt Sep 07 2005 11:36 AM

The Astros purchased Strickland's contract from AAA Round Rock on September 3 and have used him twice. He's pitched 1.2 perfect innings in middle relief, stranding 2 runners and striking out one so far. I don't believe, however, he would be eligible for the post-season roster should they make it that far. His final AAA numbers: 2-0, 5 SV, 2.37 ERA, 0.79 WHIP, 20 K, 4 BB in 19 IP.

Valadius Sep 07 2005 12:31 PM

Amending my earlier news on Glendon Rusch, he had a perfect game through 6 innings.

Edgy DC Sep 07 2005 04:10 PM

Early speculation about the Pirate job does indeed include Art Howe, as well as his successor in Oakland, Ken Macha, who has no contract for 2006. The Long Island Ducks have re-signed Bill Pusipher to join them for their playoff drive. First-year skipper Gary Carter of the Gulf Coast Mets has been named Manager of the Year for the Gulf Coast League.

Elster88 Sep 07 2005 04:13 PM

Edgy DC wrote: First-year skipper Gary Carter of the Gulf Coast Mets has been named Manager of the Year for the Gulf Coast League. I was never a huge Carter fan, I just appreciated his Metness, but I think it's nice that a retired player is willing to put in time managing in the minors. _____________________________ This post had the designation 162) Mike Phillips

MFS62 Sep 07 2005 04:26 PM

Elster88 wrote: I was never a huge Carter fan, I just appreciated his Metness, but I think it's nice that a retired player is willing to put in time managing in the minors. Sounds like there's a story there. Did you have the current Met skipper in mind when you wrote that? Later

mlbaseballtalk Sep 07 2005 06:58 PM

MFS62 wrote: ="Elster88"] I was never a huge Carter fan, I just appreciated his Metness, but I think it's nice that a retired player is willing to put in time managing in the minors. Sounds like there's a story there. Did you have the current Met skipper in mind when you wrote that? Later Before a flame war stars, I should point out that Carter last fall openly campaigned for the Met job, while Art Howe still was very much gainfully employed Steve

MFS62 Sep 07 2005 07:15 PM

Oh, No flame intended here against Carter. The fact that he is willing to pay his dues and learn the managing craft in the minors is admirable. I guess he realized (after, as you said, the Mets rejected him as Howe's successor) that nobody was going to just hand him a major league managing job without experience. Later

Elster88 Sep 08 2005 10:55 AM

mlbaseballtalk wrote: Before a flame war stars, I should point out that Carter last fall openly campaigned for the Met job, while Art Howe still was very much gainfully employed Steve I don't remember this. What did he say? Short of seeing something along the lines of a quote of his saying "I would like the Mets' manager job." I tend to doubt things like this. Also, let's not forget that Art Howe knew he was getting fired, as did the rest of the world, before the end of the season. I don't see where the flame war was going to break out, either. _____________________________ This post had the designation 161) Johnny Lewis

MFS62 Sep 08 2005 10:58 AM

]What did he say? Beats me. That was 88's comment. LAter

Elster88 Sep 08 2005 11:00 AM

I'm 88. I didn't say it. :) _____________________________ This post had the designation 161) Johnny Lewis

Rotblatt Sep 08 2005 04:08 PM

Tony Clark has hit his 24 & 25th home runs for Arizona today. He's now batting .308 on the season.

DocTee Sep 08 2005 06:06 PM

Tiggers recall Matt Ginter.

Rotblatt Sep 12 2005 11:20 AM

Kazmir hasn't allowed an earned run in his last 14 innings (all against Toronto), striking out 20 and only allowing 10 hits & 2 walks during that time. He now has a line of: 3.85 ERA, 1.45 WHIP, 8.55 K/9, 1.88 K/BB, 0.59 HR/9 Since the All-Star Break: 2.71 ERA, 1.39 WHIP, 10.58 K/9, 2.69 K/BB, 0.41 HR/9 Kid's definitely getting better.

smg58 Sep 12 2005 11:38 AM

For a 21-year-old pitching in that division when a less desperate team probably would have kept him in AAA until the All-Star Break, he's having an excellent year. His ERA is lower than Randy Johnson's, even after yesterday. And it's lower than Glavine's, Benson's, and yes, Zambrano's. (sigh)

Elster88 Sep 12 2005 11:58 AM

Sigh, indeed. _____________________________ This post had the designation 158) Mark Carreon

Rotblatt Sep 12 2005 12:59 PM

Not to induce even more heavy sighing, but the AL has averaged .30 more runs per game than the NL, which means Kaz could have been expected to give up about 5.66 fewer runs in the NL, bringing his expected NL ERA down to 3.55. In terms of park factor, however, Shea is actually playing less like a pitcher's park than Tropicana--0.974 versus 0.911. If he had played 14 games at Shea instead of Tropicana, he'd have given up around 1.953 more runs, bringing his total ERA to 3.65. HOWEVER, we've been much more efficient in terms of defense than Tampa, having converted .703 of batted balls that aren't HR into outs (good for 9th overall, 4th in the NL), compared to 0.685 for Tampa (23rd overall, 11th in the AL). I'm not sure how to equate that into his ERA, but I think that would equal 4 fewer hits, bring his WHIP down to 1.43. Likely, he'd also have better strikeout numbers. 6.4 avg for NL as opposed to 6.1 for AL--likely due to facing the pitcher--which would give him an extra 8 K's on the season. HOWEVER, he'd probably walk more, as is the case in the NL (3.2/G v. 3.0/G) likely due to walking the number 8 hitter to get to the pitcher, which brings his BB up by 5 walks. The net result? 3.65 ERA, 1.46 WHIP, 8.98 K/9, 1.87 K/BB If I had even MORE time on my hands than I obviously do, I'd factor in the divisions we play for. I mean, the guy's faced the Sox & Yankees six times this season, which has got to skew things a bit.

smg58 Sep 12 2005 11:30 PM

Don't worry about the number crunching, I think the point has been made.

Elster88 Sep 13 2005 02:05 PM

I don't remember Kazmir facing the Yanks this year. _____________________________ This post had the designation 157) Alex Ochoa

Johnny Dickshot Sep 13 2005 02:32 PM

He faced the MFYs twice and the Sox 4 times.

Elster88 Sep 13 2005 02:47 PM

I have no memory of the Y games. Maybe I blacked it out. _____________________________ This post had the designation 157) Alex Ochoa

Frayed Knot Sep 13 2005 03:26 PM

He'll miss the MFYs this week though.

Edgy DC Sep 13 2005 06:05 PM

]Michael Eisner, in Hong Kong for today's opening of a Disneyland theme park, was asked by The Associated Press to name his worst mistake during his reign as Walt Disney Co. chief executive. Eisner called the signing of Mo Vaughn by the Disney-owned Anaheim Angels after the 1998 season "the worst personnel move I've ever made or approved, worse than the one you're probably thinking about." He was referring to the naming of Michael Ovitz as Disney president in 1995. Ovitz was gone after 15 months, and he got a severance package estimated at $130 million. The Angels signed Vaughn for $80 million over six years, and he was gone after three, traded to the New York Mets. --- The Concord Monitor

smg58 Sep 14 2005 12:37 AM

And then they traded him for Appier, who they released after a year. At least we collected on insurance. So there!

seawolf17 Sep 15 2005 01:35 PM

Mike Hampton could miss all of [url=http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2162310]2006[/url] with an elbow injury.

rpackrat Sep 15 2005 02:50 PM

I never wish injury on anyone, but Hampton is a guy I just can't work up a whole lot of sympathy for.

Frayed Knot Sep 15 2005 03:08 PM

The thing about Hampton and the Braves is if you remember the deal that landed him there was a complicated 3-team multi-player trade with all kinds of contracts changing hands and mucho money being swapped as well to make those deals go down. Anyway, next year is the year where the Braves start paying full freight on Hampton. Up to this point, the Marlins & Rox were chipping in so as to partially escape the obligations to Preston Wilson, Charles Johnson, et al. Now I'm sure that Schurholz & co have long taken this into consideration and have had their budgets reflect the cost as if it were approx $9mil/yr instead of $3 - $3 - $3 - $15 - $15 - $15 (or whatever the exact figures are). Still, if he needs the surgery that takes a big bite out of their total. I guess they'll just be forced to bring some 20 y/o up out of single-A to go 15-4 as a replacement.

Edgy DC Sep 16 2005 03:39 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 16 2005 05:29 PM

Duquette, Wendell to be inducted into the UNICO Berkshire County Hall of Fame. Someday we should compile a list of which Mets are in which Halls of Fame, great and small.

sharpie Sep 16 2005 05:25 PM

Jeff Reardon has a ballfield named after him in the Berkshires so I'll bet he's in that HOF too.

MFS62 Sep 17 2005 03:29 PM

Jason Tyner had three hits (one a triple) and two RBI for the Twins today, and his average sits at .350. The Twins and Santana shut out the White Sox. Man, that race in the AL Central is getting close. Later

Valadius Sep 17 2005 03:58 PM

Well we all knew Jason Tyner could hit for average. The problem was his amazing lack of power.

Edgy DC Sep 22 2005 09:30 AM

Weak profile of Ken Singleton.

metirish Sep 22 2005 09:56 AM

]September 22, 2005 -- HARTFORD, Conn. — The state human-rights agency is looking into a bias complaint at a Greenwich beach involving several women, including the wives of two former New York Mets. The state Commission on Human Rights and Opportunities is investigating the claim by Millie Bonilla and Sheila Foster that they were not allowed to enter the beach at Greenwich Point Park on June 7 because of the color of their skin. The women are part of an exercise group of mostly black and Hispanic residents. Bonilla, who is Hispanic, and Foster, who is black, are the wives of former Mets Bobby Bonilla and George Foster. AP http://www.nypost.com/news/nationalnews/28380.htm

Elster88 Sep 22 2005 10:04 AM

Sigh. I've been to that beach before. They might keep you out if you aren't a snooty rich snob, but not because of race. My friend bowled with Bobby Bo a couple of times here in CT. _____________________________ This post had the designation 147) Jeff Reardon

Yancy Street Gang Sep 22 2005 10:21 AM

Interesting that the Bonilla and Foster wives hang out together. Their husbands could be a 20,000 Pyramid category: Expensive Mets Outfielders Who Flopped. I'm glad, at least, that Millie Bonilla seems to have gotten past that lip-synching scandal from a few years back.

ScarletKnight41 Sep 22 2005 10:28 AM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I'm glad, at least, that Millie Bonilla seems to have gotten past that lip-synching scandal from a few years back. That's a coffee-spewing statement <g>

Elster88 Sep 22 2005 10:28 AM

Bobby Bo had a better inaugural Mets' season than our current center fielder. Actually, Foster kind of did too. _____________________________ This post had the designation 147) Jeff Reardon

Valadius Sep 22 2005 10:32 AM

I'm going home tomorrow, so I'll be able to grab my picture of me with George Foster.

Edgy DC Sep 22 2005 10:38 AM

That's Millie Bonillie on the right.

Elster88 Sep 22 2005 10:47 AM

Retired Wifey Watch? _____________________________ This post had the designation 147) Jeff Reardon

Edgy DC Sep 22 2005 10:48 AM

Not a bad idea. I just ran out of hours in the week though.

MFS62 Sep 22 2005 12:16 PM

About the Ken Singleton interview. When I read it, I was surprised to learn that Paul Olden is Black. Let me modify that - I wasn't surprised but it is no longer an issue I think about any more when I hear a good announcer. Why? Because I remembered Billy Sample - once an outfielder with the Rangers. MMYF and I were in the car and happened upon a post game radio show. A player was being interviewed. We listened, enthralled by the player's voice. This voice wasn't just any voice, it was a true baritone instrument. And there was no "ballplayer speak" - he was clear and erudite. At the end of the interview, we learned it was Sample. We agreed that when his playing career was through, he would have a great career in broadcasting. But I thought about stereotyping and really felt ashamed. Sample later went on to work in the media, but it was as a writer - he had a sports column for USA Today. I read him for years, then one day he wrote that he was leaving, because he didn't like the fact that people he met for the first time were "surprised that a Black man had such good communicating skills" and opined that he may have been hired only because he was Black. I wrote him a letter asking him not to resign; that he was hired because he was very good at what he did. He never replied to my letter. I wonder what he's doing these days, and I wonder what he thinks about the "in-your-face Blackness" of Steven A. Smith on ESPN/ ESPN Radio. Later

Rotblatt Sep 22 2005 04:30 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 22 2005 10:19 PM

Some tidbits about Gooden from Hardball Times: http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/ten-things-i-didnt-know-last-week20/ ]Dwight Gooden threw a lot of pitches at a very young age. At Baseball Analysts, Rich Lederer has been having a discussion about Dwight Gooden's unrealized great career. The question, spurred by Bert Blyleven's comments about Gooden's drug use, is whether pitching too many innings was also a factor in his decline. Even sportswriter Bob Klapisch gave an opinion, claiming that Gooden's decline was totally due to drug abuse. There's no doubt that Gooden ruined his career (and, more importantly, his life) by taking drugs. But there's also very little doubt that he was overused at the tender ages of 18, 19 and 20. In that first year, 1983, he had an incredible record for Single A Lynchburg, striking out 300 and walking 112 in 191 innings. I applied Tangotiger's pitch count estimator to those numbers and found that Gooden threw an estimated 3,356 pitches at Lynchburg. So far this year, only three major league pitchers have thrown more often. As I said, he was 18 at the time. Mets' manager Davey Johnson saw Gooden pitch in the minors, and he convinced General Manager Frank Cashen that Gooden was ready for the major leagues in 1984. Johnson was right, as Gooden went on to compile a 2.60 ERA with 276 strikeouts in 218 innings. He threw approximately 3,475 pitches, including 15 games in which he probably threw over 120 pitches. I estimate that he threw 142 pitches on September 1 and 140 on July 27. He was 19. Next was 1985, the year Gooden dominated hitters as few pitchers ever have, with a 1.53 ERA and 268 strikeouts in 276 innings. That’s a lot of innings; in fact, only two major league pitchers have reached that mark since (Charlie Hough and Roger Clemens in 1987). Did I mention that he was 20 years old at the time? I estimate he threw 4,068 pitches that year, including 153 on October 2 after throwing 140 in his previous start. There were five games in which he threw at least 140 pitches. For a bit more perspective, I applied Baseball Prospectus's Pitcher Abuse Points (PAP) to Gooden's pitch count. BPro's research indicates that every pitch thrown in excess of 100 pitches in a start has a wearing effect on a pitcher's arm. In fact, it is exactly research like this that has led to a new understanding of how to handle young pitchers. According to PAP, Gooden racked up 437,598 PAP in 1984 when he was 19. This year, only strong-armed Livan Hernandez has surpassed that score. Carlos Zambrano is second at 160,000 (a total for which the Cubs' manager has been criticized by some Cubs' fans). In 1985, Gooden reached over 820,000 Pitcher Abuse Points. Baseball Prospectus doesn't have PAP stats for all years listed, but it appears as though that figure has been exceeded only once in the last 10 years, by the aforementioned Hernandez. I glanced through Davey Johnson's great book covering the 1985 season, Bats: The Man Behind the Miracle, and found several references to Gooden's workload. Johnson was aware of Gooden's workload; in fact, Cashen urged him to do something about it. Johnson didn't. ]Of course, I would prefer Doc only throw 250, 260 innings. But you have to take into account that Dwight doesn't throw as many pitches in a game as most power pitchers. He's unusual. Nolan Ryan will throw 150 pitches in a ballgame. Dwight seldom gets over 140. Most of the time it'll be between 100 and 130. So the strain is less. We certainly have a different attitude about pitch counts today, don't we? Nolan Ryan was truly unique in his ability to handle a large number of innings. But it's also worth noting that he was rested more often early in his career, and he didn't reach Gooden's level of Innings Pitched until the age of 25. I'm not saying that drugs didn't ruin Gooden's career. Of course they did. But if we don't also remember that Gooden was tremendously overworked at a very young age, we'll have forgotten an important lesson. edited to take Edgy's suggestion about the block quotes.

Edgy DC Sep 22 2005 04:38 PM

Excellent, and worthy of a seperate thread. You may want to blockquote that exerpt form the Johnson book, so it's clear that Davey is speaking. There's also lubitel's theory that the Mets hurt him by tinkering with his motion. Klapisch seems pretty narrow-minded here. On the other hand, while Gooden's effectiveness waned, it's not like he had a full-scale elbow blowout.

sharpie Sep 22 2005 04:51 PM

]Bobby Bo had a better inaugural Mets' season than our current center fielder. Actually, Foster kind of did too By what measure? Bobby 19-70-.249-780 George 13-70-247-676 Carlos 15-71-260-817 Carlos has also stolen more bases and plays better defense.

Yancy Street Gang Sep 22 2005 04:55 PM

And you can't argue that more was expected of Carlos. The expectations for George and Bobby were equally high.

Edgy DC Sep 22 2005 05:05 PM

Measuring by OPS+ Foster: 90 in 608 plate appearances. Bonilla: 121 in 506 plate appearances. We'll look at Beltran soon enough.

Edgy DC Sep 22 2005 08:52 PM

Billy Sample hosts a streaming program at mlb.com, and also calls pre-season games for them. He also participates in this program.

Elster88 Sep 22 2005 10:57 PM

sharpie wrote: ]Bobby Bo had a better inaugural Mets' season than our current center fielder. Actually, Foster kind of did too By what measure? Bobby 19-70-.249-780 George 13-70-247-676 Carlos 15-71-260-817 Carlos has also stolen more bases and plays better defense. Oops. For both of them I was thinking of their second seasons.

Edgy DC Sep 23 2005 12:14 AM

Ray Rippelmeyer, Mets roving minor league pitching coach, has been selected for induction into the Southeast Missouri State University Athletic Hall of Fame.

Yancy Street Gang Sep 24 2005 06:37 PM

Somebody submitted this memory to the UMDB: I met Bruce Berenyi a couple of years ago at a Super Bowl party in Ft. Lauderdale, where he now lives. Apparently, he's one of a small number of former major league players who have come out as gay after their playing careers ended. When I met him, he was playing on a team in the Ft. Lauderdale gay softball league. I haven't approved it, and won't unless I can get some official corroboration that this is true. Anybody hear anything about this? As far as I know, the only "out" former player is the other Billy Bean. If Bruce Berenyi was on this short list, I'm sure I'd know about it.

Edgy DC Sep 24 2005 10:56 PM

Check this out. Under the headline "NAGAAA Cracks Down On Sandbagging."

ScarletKnight41 Sep 24 2005 11:29 PM

Only a true gay icon would have found that kind of documentation.

mlbaseballtalk Sep 24 2005 11:31 PM

="Yancy Street Gang"]Somebody submitted this memory to the UMDB: I met Bruce Berenyi a couple of years ago at a Super Bowl party in Ft. Lauderdale, where he now lives. Apparently, he's one of a small number of former major league players who have come out as gay after their playing careers ended. When I met him, he was playing on a team in the Ft. Lauderdale gay softball league. I haven't approved it, and won't unless I can get some official corroboration that this is true. Anybody hear anything about this? As far as I know, the only "out" former player is the other Billy Bean. If Bruce Berenyi was on this short list, I'm sure I'd know about it. The late ex-Dodger Glenn Burke came out before he died of AIDS AFAIK he and Bean are the only widely reported outed MLBers

Yancy Street Gang Sep 25 2005 06:38 AM

Edgy DC wrote: Check this out. Under the headline "NAGAAA Cracks Down On Sandbagging." Wow. That site even has a (very) outdated link to the UMDB. What do we all think? Is that good enough corroboration?

mlbaseballtalk Sep 26 2005 09:29 PM

Old Friend Lenny Dykstra can be heard every Monday with Jim Cramer on his Real Money radio show (heard in NYC on 710 WOR [url]http://www.thestreet.com/p/index.html[/url] He's also been writing on TheStreet.com every Tuesday [url]http://www.thestreet.com/_tscs/comment/nailsnumbers/10243337.html[/url] Not the most WTF Stock Tipper of all time, that still belongs to former CNBC staffer John Leyfield, better known as WWE wrestler John Bradshaw Leyfield Steve

cooby Sep 26 2005 09:37 PM

I just cannot imagine taking stock tips from Lenny. Though they are certainly well written.

Edgy DC Sep 26 2005 10:31 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Sep 26 2005 10:54 PM

What are you particularly worried about? Is it technically outing by printing a report that he's out? If it's important, call the NAGAAAA and confirm it with them.

Johnny Dickshot Sep 26 2005 10:50 PM

Wow. Well, his name was Bruce...

cooby Sep 28 2005 06:52 PM

Here's Mackey... http://www.wallace.edu/athletics/baseball/ You can even email him if you wish http://www.wallace.edu/staff/mailer.php?id1=Sasser&id2=Mackey

Edgy DC Sep 28 2005 08:46 PM

Nice job. That huge chin is unmistakeable.

mlbaseballtalk Sep 28 2005 08:58 PM

cooby wrote: Here's Mackey... Funny story about Sasser. In the summer of 98, Piazza is struggling in his first summer at Shea. A caller calls up Ian Eagle on a WFAN weekend evening show and rips Piazza's streakiness and lack of throwing runners out (gee the more things change around here...) and calls him a "Glorified Mackey Sasser" Okay, I guess mildly amusing, I mean even back then Piazza was Future HOFer material, and of course Mackey was a servicable backstop untill he couldn't throw the ball back to the mound anymore! Steve

Edgy DC Sep 28 2005 11:15 PM

Mike Piazza never struggled that summer. Month BA OBP SLG OpS May .419 .455 .484 .939 June .318 .365 .511 .876 July .326 .421 .576 .997 August .347 .414 .663 1.077 September .378 .457 .720 1.177 June was the worst he did. I'd take a career of that from my next catcher in a heartbeat.

mlbaseballtalk Sep 29 2005 08:18 AM

]Mike Piazza never struggled that summer. Month BA OBP SLG OpS May .419 .455 .484 .939 June .318 .365 .511 .876 July .326 .421 .576 .997 August .347 .414 .663 1.077 September .378 .457 .720 1.177 June was the worst he did. I'd take a career of that from my next catcher in a heartbeat. Well that is true, but the perception at the time was that he was having a bad stretch and wasn't living up to expectations and not handling the pressure of being in NY So you had callers calling up WFAN every day wondering why we got him in the first place and there really was questions about wheither we SHOULD lock him up to ANY sort of deal in the winter True story I don't recall the Listserv and/or Metsonline.com's board if they were being the same way, but you did hear alot of yahoos saying they were having fun booing Piazza at Shea that summer on WFAN. Another funny one was this guy gleefully say he was seeing tons of little kids wearing Piazza shirts that were booing Piazza (obviously the kids were too young to even know or appreciate Mike Piazza so they were joining the lemmings that summer) Steve

cooby Sep 29 2005 09:19 AM

Edgy DC wrote: Nice job. That huge chin is unmistakeable. Yeah, Mackey was a family favorite sometime around 1990. My daughter even got a little postcard from him, I think I still have it somewhere

metirish Sep 29 2005 09:27 AM

Strawberry in trouble again... ]By Associated Press September 29, 2005, 7:04 AM EDT DELRAY BEACH, Fla. -- Former baseball star Darryl Strawberry was charged with filing a false police report after investigators watching a gas station surveillance video saw him drive off in a different sport utility vehicle than the one he reported stolen, The Palm Beach Post reported on its Web site Thursday. Strawberry told a detective Wednesday that he lied when he reported on Sept. 17 that his rental SUV, a silver Nissan Murano, was stolen from a Delray Beach gas station. But in a surveillance video of the gas station viewed by investigators, Strawberry appeared to be the passenger in a Land Rover driven by a woman, police said. The video also showed him purchasing items in the station's convenience store, then getting back into the vehicle and leaving, according to police. Strawberry, 43, was charged with filing a false police report, and is scheduled to appear in court Oct. 27. Strawberry told The Palm Beach Post that he "didn't want to make a public thing out of it." Detective Nicole Guerriero told the newspaper that she spoke to a tipster who said Strawberry's SUV was behind a Lake Worth sports bar, where police later found it. According to a police report, the woman who allegedly left with the vehicle said she met Strawberry at a motel and he gave her the keys to his SUV, which she turned over to authorities. "He didn't say what happened to the vehicle," Guerriero said. "Somehow it got into someone else's possession." A phone message left early Thursday for a Delray Beach Police spokesman wasn't immediately returned.

Edgy DC Sep 29 2005 09:30 AM

]Well that is true, but the perception at the time was that he was having a bad stretch and wasn't living up to expectations and not handling the pressure of being in NY. Yahoos have a way of making so much noise as to cause people to mistake their braying for fact. Those boobirds were undercutting a fine team.

Elster88 Sep 29 2005 09:36 AM

Maybe we could make it a policy that Strawberry is assumed to be in some kind of trouble until we hear otherwise.

MFS62 Sep 29 2005 03:14 PM

]Red Sox acquire Stanton for final four games BOSTON (AP) … The Red Sox acquired left-hander Mike Stanton from the Washington Nationals on Thursday for right-handers Rhys Taylor and Yader Peralta. Boston's trade means Stanton could wind up pitching this weekend against his former team, the New York Yankees. If the Red Sox advance to the playoffs, Stanton would not be eligible for the postseason roster. Stanton, who is 38, started the season with the Yankees and was cut June 30 after going 1-2 with a 7.08 ERA in 14 innings over 28 relief appearances. He signed with Washington on July 13 and went 2-1 with a 3.58 ERA in 27 2-3 innings over 30 games. Their bullpen must really be in a bad way. Later

Edgy DC Sep 29 2005 03:35 PM

I expected that one or both of these teams would hit the trade market going into this series. Part of me wondered if Trachsel might be a Sock or a Yankee before last night. Of course, Cleveland and Boston can block a Yankee deal. Today, with the Yankees ahead of Boston and Cleveland tied with them, may have been the only time that Boston could've snuck the deal through unblocked.

cooby Sep 29 2005 04:07 PM

MFS62 wrote: Their bullpen must really be in a bad way. Later Well, it is now...

86-Dreamer Sep 29 2005 04:10 PM

what about players who reportedly passed through waivers back in August (high priced vets like Sosa, Piazza etc.)? can they be traded freely now or do they have to be waived again - giving teams chance to block the move? it is pretty funny that Embree and Stanton sucked so bad as LOOGYs for each team that they ended up on the other.

MFS62 Sep 29 2005 04:14 PM

I believe if they passed all the way through, with every team having a chance to claim them, they can be traded immediately. If a team put in a claim for them when they passed through the last time, I believe you have to either deal with that club, or get them to withdraw their claim. Later EDIT typos

Edgy DC Sep 29 2005 04:55 PM

I think no waiver claim is valid if made by a team that's now ahead of you in the standings.

seawolf17 Sep 29 2005 04:58 PM

No... if a team claimed your player, and you didn't deal him or let him go to that team -- and pulled him back -- then he's yours. You can't run him through waivers again, and he can't be dealt... I think he can only be cut at this point (or at least DFAed).

Frayed Knot Sep 30 2005 12:07 AM

seawolf17 wrote: No... if a team claimed your player, and you didn't deal him or let him go to that team -- and pulled him back -- then he's yours. You can't run him through waivers again, and he can't be dealt... I think he can only be cut at this point (or at least DFAed). Yeah a player CAN be put on the wire again in the same waiver period. The only difference is that the 2nd time it must be IRrevocable waivers - ie. he can't be pulled back if claimed. In a case like Stanton - who almost shirley passed unclaimed the first time around - I assume he can be dealt unencumbered (except for his personal no trade clause of course) from the moment he cleared through the remainder of the season. IOW, he didn't have to clear waivers just this week as long as he cleared earlier as far as I know. There are limits on how long those waivers of good for but I think Aug/Sept is one waiver period. Which reminds me that some MFY fan called FAN the other day demanding that the Yanx strike a deal for AJ Burnett just for this weekend. Of course he slid right past those minor details about how he'd get through waivers, who they might give up for him, why the Marlins would lose out on the draft pick compensation just to help the Yanx, etc. ... but it was a nice try.

Edgy DC Oct 03 2005 12:14 AM

Apparently, Mrs. Shaun Fitzmaurice was a teen-aged basketball star. At least, I think they're talking about basketball. It's not terribly clear.

Edgy DC Oct 05 2005 11:47 AM

John Franco takes credit for Astro success.

MFS62 Oct 05 2005 12:17 PM

Improving a pitching staff by no longer being on it? Johnie boy wouldn't be the first pitcher to be able to claim that. Later

cooby Oct 05 2005 09:35 PM

So, Yancy, have you emailed Mackey and invited him to join us yet?

Yancy Street Gang Oct 06 2005 09:02 AM

No. I've been hurt too many times.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 06 2005 09:25 AM

Come on Yancy - you need to have a thick skin about these things!

cooby Oct 06 2005 09:31 AM

How could you not trust this face? Come on, he's waiting for us

Yancy Street Gang Oct 06 2005 09:38 AM

You're setting me up for another heartbreak, aren't you? I think my skills aren't suited for the Welcome Wagon committee. Somebody else should step in and take my place.

cooby Oct 06 2005 11:39 AM

I'll bet Mackey's not like those other guys

HahnSolo Oct 06 2005 03:38 PM

I hope Mackey returns e-mails better than he returned balls back to the pitcher.

Yancy Street Gang Oct 06 2005 03:45 PM

He probably circles his mouse above the Send button a bunch of times before he finally clicks it.

cooby Oct 06 2005 03:47 PM

You guys!!!! When Yancy writes to him and he comes here and reads this, after Yancy writes to him, he's gonna be sad and leave!!

HahnSolo Oct 06 2005 03:52 PM

Edit. repost. Maybe I should stop making fun of Mackey.

cooby Oct 06 2005 03:57 PM

I am sure Yancy will smooth things over

Yancy Street Gang Oct 06 2005 04:10 PM

I'M NOT WRITING TO MACKEY! I refuse to be your, um, Mackey Lackey!

TheOldMole Oct 06 2005 05:29 PM

So when you write to Mackey, say hello for me.

MFS62 Oct 06 2005 06:02 PM

Jaimie Cerda was picked up by Colorado on waivers from KC. Later

Edgy DC Oct 13 2005 12:39 PM

Southeast Missouri State University presents "Why Bob Gibson Should Have Been Outlawed from Baseball." I imagine Gibson would tell you that he was.

Willets Point Oct 13 2005 12:53 PM

Was Swoboda the former Met folks were anxiously looking for in the wake of Katrina?

Edgy DC Oct 13 2005 01:02 PM

And the guy presenting that lecture has a former teammate whose daughter is starring in goal for University of South Florida's women's soccer team. And he has a former opponent who will continue managing the US international squad in November, leading a team of minor leaguers looking to qualify for the Olympics.

Edgy DC Oct 13 2005 01:10 PM

And one of his former players will be The Street.com's first celebrity investor. Not Martha Stewart?

DocTee Oct 13 2005 01:14 PM

Oakland has asked for--and received-- permission to interview Texas pitching coach Orel Hershisher for its managerial vacancy. They've already spoken to in-house candidates Bob Geren and Ron Washington...

Edgy DC Oct 15 2005 12:03 AM

Yes, by the way, Swoboda was the former Met whose whereabouts following the hurricane were unknown.

Yancy Street Gang Oct 17 2005 04:30 PM

Did Dwight Gooden get arrested again or something? He's getting a huge number of hits today on the UMDB, and they're not all coming from the same source. A lot of people are doing Google, Yahoo, etc. searches on his name today. Anybody have any idea why? I searched in Google News, and there's nothing news. I did a straight Google search, and the UMDB was the second page listed! (And maybe that explains it. Maybe that page was recently re-ranked, and it moved up to a prominent notch.)

Edgy DC Oct 17 2005 04:33 PM

Cleon Jones had appeared as the top hit once or twice this week. I feared the worst.* *That the Yankees had hired him or something.

Willets Point Oct 17 2005 04:51 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: Did Dwight Gooden get arrested again or something? He's getting a huge number of hits today on the UMDB, and they're not all coming from the same source. A lot of people are doing Google, Yahoo, etc. searches on his name today. Anybody have any idea why? I searched in Google News, and there's nothing news. I did a straight Google search, and the UMDB was the second page listed! (And maybe that explains it. Maybe that page was recently re-ranked, and it moved up to a prominent notch.) Any articles on the 20th anniversary of the Cy Young year, or about the Astros-Mets in '86 playoffs may have done it. Dunno otherwise.

MFS62 Oct 17 2005 04:54 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Cleon Jones had appeared as the top hit once or twice this week. I feared the worst.* *That the Yankees had hired him or something. To play center field?

seawolf17 Oct 18 2005 05:53 AM

Gooden is profiled in a USA Today cover story today, under the headline "Demons Still Haunt Gooden, Familiy." Don't know how that correlates to increased traffic yesterday, but I'd bet you'll see more today,

Elster88 Oct 18 2005 10:45 AM

Oakland picked up Jay Payton's 2006 option.

metirish Oct 21 2005 10:22 AM Edited 7 time(s), most recently on Oct 21 2005 01:53 PM

[url=http://www.northjersey.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpcnk3ZjczN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXkxMDYmZmdiZWw3Zjd2cWVlRUV5eTY3OTU1MDYmeXJpcnk3ZjcxN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXk2]Bowa joins Yanks[/url]

Edgy DC Oct 21 2005 10:30 AM

Bowa vs. Steinbrenner would be interesting.

metirish Oct 21 2005 10:38 AM

A question, how did you put your articles like you did with the names?...

MFS62 Oct 21 2005 11:10 AM

Yes, how do you title the links? Later

ScarletKnight41 Oct 21 2005 11:12 AM

First, make sure the Disable BBCCode in this post box is unchecked. Then it's [ url= (without spaces) Then you put in the site Then you close the bracket Then you type in the name you want Then you type [/ url (again, without spaces) Then you close the bracket. Good luck!

Edgy DC Oct 21 2005 11:20 AM

I used HTML. Here's the post I did above, except replacing < and > with parentheses so the code appears instead of the links. (a href=http://www.nypost.com/sports/29845.htm target=blank)Rusty Staub(/a), happy for the good peeps of Houston. (a href=http://www.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/getsp.pl5?sb20051021a1.htm target=blank)Bobby Valentine(/a), in championship mode. Replace "(" and ")" above with "<" and ">" and you're a linking fool.

metirish Oct 21 2005 12:08 PM

Umm I can't seem to figue it out....

ScarletKnight41 Oct 21 2005 01:49 PM

[url=www.whatever.com]Name The Website[/url] Do that while unclicking the Diable BBCode in this post box.

metirish Oct 21 2005 01:55 PM

Thanks SK and Edgy....I did it..

SwitchHitter Oct 21 2005 02:04 PM

Bowa Denies Reports of Agreeing to Join Yankees

ScarletKnight41 Oct 21 2005 02:07 PM

Glad to help Irish :)

Edgy DC Oct 21 2005 03:56 PM

Assistant Coach Bobby Jones, already a Hall of Famer at Fresno State, gets his jersey retired.

sharpie Oct 21 2005 04:05 PM

So does that mean that Bobby Jones isn't permitted to wear his own number as an (interim) assistant coach?

Edgy DC Oct 21 2005 04:12 PM

Good point. I was wondering if Jersey Jones was going to get his fresno retired by anybody.

SwitchHitter Oct 21 2005 05:38 PM

sharpie wrote: So does that mean that Bobby Jones isn't permitted to wear his own number as an (interim) assistant coach? He can probably still wear it, but no one else can. Cheo Cruz's number 25 was retired by the Astros, but he still wears it as their 1B coach.

sharpie Oct 21 2005 10:58 PM

Thanks. I've always wondered that.

seawolf17 Oct 22 2005 06:48 AM

Bobby Bonilla took his daughter to the Greenwich HS college night Thursday night. An interesting mix of celebrities and ordinary rich people; Tom Bergeron (the Hollywood Squares/AFV host) was there with his kid, and apparently Cody Gifford is a sophomore there, so maybe Frank & Kathie Lee will be around next year.

Edgy DC Oct 24 2005 12:40 AM

The ceremonial first pitch, for the first game of the World Series, was thrown by Bo Jackson, but caught by Robin Ventura. J.C. Martin was a member of the 1959 Sox. Bob Shaw, also, apparently. Thanks, Joe Gergen. Rusty Staub is taken to task. (The Globe has also challenged Pedro Martinez on this score.) David Cone isn't so sure he wants to join the Mets broadcast crew. The Star Ledger claims inside knowledge that Bobby Valentine is heading to the Devil Rays.

Edgy DC Oct 24 2005 01:25 PM

Robin Ventura, in addition to Tim Wallach, has reportedly turned down an offer from the Pirates to be their hitting coach. Jose Vizcaino blew some minds last night.

Willets Point Oct 24 2005 02:29 PM

="Edgy DC"] Rusty Staub is taken to task. (The Globe has also challenged Pedro Martinez on this score.) The Globe also recognizes Mo Vaughn as a good charitable contributor.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 24 2005 03:18 PM

<<That 3B is Imao, who is now 8-8 in the Series. >> How can he be laughing YOUR ass off? (j/k)

Willets Point Oct 25 2005 02:12 PM

Thanks. I'll put that link out to anyone wanting to get me a Christmas gift.

Edgy DC Oct 26 2005 09:20 AM

"Vinegar Bend" Mizell recalled by Houston Chronicle columnist Leon Hale: Q: Do you remember "Vinegar Bend" Mizell? A: You bet. Wilmer Mizell, from Vinegar Bend, Ala. In the early '50s he was a hot pitcher with the Houston Buffs, and Buffs owner Alan Russell once brought the entire population of Vinegar Bend (one busload) to Houston to watch Mizell pitch. Mizell went to the majors as a Cardinal, pitched in a World Series for Pittsburg (sic) and finished his career with the Mets. Then he became a U.S. congressman from Mississippi. I don't recall anything about his record in Congress, but as a pitcher Vinegar Bend was always a little bit wild.

Willets Point Oct 26 2005 10:46 AM

I miss 'em a ton. They're (wait for it) ... Real Mets!

Edgy DC Oct 27 2005 04:00 PM

The off-season has begun. Mike DeJean has re-upped with the Rocks. Joe McIllvaine wants the Phils GM job.

Edgy DC Oct 27 2005 05:25 PM

The Mariners (are they American?) are making changes to their coaching staff, and Mel Stottlemyre and Roger Mcdowell are among the candidates. TheStreet.com has been raking in beaucoup bucks since Lenny Dykstra started luring morons to their site. Former Met prospect Rudy Hernandez returns as hitting coach for the Beloit Snappers.

ScarletKnight41 Oct 28 2005 08:48 AM

Thank you Irish. I showed that clip to MK before school this morning, and he loved it :)

Valadius Oct 29 2005 10:11 PM

Roger McDowell was hired as the new pitching coach of the Atlanta Braves today.

mlbaseballtalk Oct 29 2005 10:43 PM

Valadius wrote: Roger McDowell was hired as the new pitching coach of the Atlanta Braves today. On the Braves site the picture is of him as a Dodger! He spent a season and a half more as a Met BTW Steve

SI Metman Oct 30 2005 01:22 AM

Maybe he'll give John Smoltz a hot foot next season.

MFS62 Oct 30 2005 09:39 AM

I'd have the umpires check the condition of the balls very carefully. Remember Roger's tool belt? Later

Edgy DC Oct 30 2005 11:52 PM

Scott Podsednik was credited with eight at-bats in the 14-inning victory over the Astros in Game 3, the most ever in a Series game, breaking the record of 7 held by Don Hahn of the Mets in Game 2 of the 1973 Series against the A's in Oakland.

TheOldMole Oct 31 2005 07:34 AM

I remember that Roger ran Gregg Jefferies out of town.

mlbaseballtalk Oct 31 2005 08:20 AM

TheOldMole wrote: I remember that Roger ran Gregg Jefferies out of town. Uh, how can that be possible when Roger was traded in 89? Should be the other way around

TheOldMole Oct 31 2005 08:27 AM

Well, an exaggeration. Roger was a leader of the hate-Jefferies faction in the Mets clubhouse.

Elster88 Oct 31 2005 09:12 AM

I never pictured Roger as a coach. Now he's replacing one of the better pitching coaches. Interesting.

Yancy Street Gang Oct 31 2005 10:16 AM

TheOldMole wrote: Well, an exaggeration. Roger was a leader of the hate-Jefferies faction in the Mets clubhouse. So was Randy Myers, if I remember correctly.

Edgy DC Oct 31 2005 11:04 AM

Who Jefferies also seriously outlived.

Centerfield Oct 31 2005 01:33 PM

I hated Gregg Jefferies too. Because of him I tried swinging my bat in a pool and I still sucked. And my bat got rusty.

MFS62 Oct 31 2005 01:37 PM

Centerfield wrote: I hated Gregg Jefferies too. Because of him I tried swinging my bat in a pool and I still sucked. And my bat got rusty. That's what you get for using a metal bat. (Aluminum rusts?) Later

PatchyFogg Nov 02 2005 11:54 AM

When I was a kid, Roger McDowell appeared at our Little League Awards Night (back when you could book a major leaguer for 500 bucks). His wife Karen was so pretty that she signed as many autographs as he did. But, alas, I hear that they are divorced now.

MFS62 Nov 02 2005 11:59 AM

I spoke with Mrs. McDowell and Mrs. Whitey Ford when they were guests on the Ann Liguori radio show on WFAN. (On her show, you could speak with the in-studio guests) I asked Mrs. Ford whether she could recommend any tools (for doctoring the ball like the ones like Whitey used to use) for Roger's tool belt. They all got a kick out of my comments. Later

Valadius Nov 02 2005 12:02 PM

Remember... Stu Sternberg and the rest of my dad's friends in the D-Rays ownership group are from New Jersey. And I know of at least one of them that's a Mets fan. So it wouldn't surprise me if he ended up in Tampa Bay.

HahnSolo Nov 02 2005 12:03 PM

Edgy wrote: ]Scott Podsednik was credited with eight at-bats in the 14-inning victory over the Astros in Game 3, the most ever in a Series game, breaking the record of 7 held by Don Hahn of the Mets in Game 2 of the 1973 Series against the A's in Oakland. Damn you, Scott Podsednik!!

Edgy DC Nov 02 2005 02:02 PM

Bobby Valentine wins the prestigious Shoriki Award. [url=http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051102&content_id=1263510&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]Gerry Hunsicker[/url] is expected to accept a somewhat less prestigious job in the Tampa Bay Devil Rays front office. Larry Bowa has officially signed on as Yankee third base coach. Jerry DiPoto has been named the director of professional scouting by the Diamondbacks. (Fourth story.) Tsuyoshi Shinjo has re-signed with the Hokkaido Nippon Ham Fighters for 220 million yen.

metirish Nov 02 2005 02:10 PM

And how many dollars is 220 million yen....I hate math...1 yen = 0.01 $...not a lot really..

MFS62 Nov 02 2005 02:38 PM

It'll be interesting to see if Bowa can control his famous temper now that he's a Yankee. Or do you think they hired him to be a "hired gun" because of some radio fandroid comments this year about how Torre didn't demonstrate any fire? DISCLAIMER: I'm not suggesting that baseball executives make hiring decisions based on fan calls to sportstalk stations. Later

Edgy DC Nov 02 2005 02:43 PM

Hiring Bowa was reportedly Torre's initiative. 220,000,000.00 JPY = 1,883,653.93 USD

MFS62 Nov 02 2005 04:03 PM

And I just heard that the Yanks came to terms with Maz for another coaching position with the team. Later

metirish Nov 02 2005 04:10 PM

He's back as bench coach I believe.

Edgy DC Nov 02 2005 08:11 PM

Mike Piazza (who I guess is kinda sorta a former Met) is inducted intot the Italian-American Sports Hall of Fame.

mlbaseballtalk Nov 02 2005 08:25 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Mike Piazza (who I guess is kinda sorta a former Met) is inducted intot the Italian-American Sports Hall of Fame. True, but ya don't want to quite say it untill he signs a contract

Valadius Nov 03 2005 11:46 AM

Gooden Pleads Guilty [url]http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AgLJ__nvaL5ywwZH9KQh7f4RvLYF?slug=ap-goodenplea&prov=ap&type=lgns[/url]

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 12:17 PM

]``This is a person who children and young teens respect and has the potential to make a tremendous difference in kids' lives,'' prosecutor Pam Bondi said. Um, yeah, I guess, but exactly what year are you living in, counselor?

Edgy DC Nov 03 2005 12:52 PM

[url=http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051103&content_id=1264052&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]Gerry Hunsicker[/url]'s role will be "senior vice president of baseball operations.' Was that Duquette's title here? Gulfport's own Matt Lawton is very sorry and accepts his punishment. All for now.

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 01:59 PM

I think this will go down as the longest thread one day. (I don't count Apropos of nothing as a thread since, by definition, there is no actual common theme throughout it.)

SwitchHitter Nov 03 2005 02:10 PM

This is the thread that doesn't end because there are a lot of former Mets and most of them are doing stuff, some of which is interesting.

Valadius Nov 03 2005 02:24 PM

Indeed.

Willets Point Nov 03 2005 03:21 PM

The Former Mets Who are Doing Really Dull Things thread never got too much interest.

Centerfield Nov 03 2005 03:35 PM

This thread lasted longer than Swan Swan H.

Frayed Knot Nov 03 2005 03:48 PM

I hate this thread!

MFS62 Nov 03 2005 03:51 PM

Frayed Knot wrote: I hate this thread! Whaddaya want? Its off season. Later

Frayed Knot Nov 03 2005 04:09 PM

Yeah, but too many things are getting thrown into this thread simply because it involves a one-time Met, things that could stand up quite nicely on their own - like Bobby V and the Chiba Marines march to the Japan Series for instance - but are being stuffed in here and will soon be lost in the massiveness of this catch-all category. In short, I think we're falling in love with "All Purpose" threads to the point where people are afraid to start new ones and it's to the detriment of better discussions. This thread is just the primo example IMO. [/off soapbox]

Elster88 Nov 03 2005 04:19 PM

Frayed Knot wrote: [/off soapbox] You should've just gone with [/soapbox].

cooby Nov 04 2005 10:33 AM

FK: Yep It kind of reminds me of keeping everything in your cupboard in pretty Tupperware containers, so that when you want something to eat, you cant find what you want, so you give up and don't eat anything

metirish Nov 04 2005 10:38 AM

It's a good point Frayed Knot, I had wanted to start a thread about the Japan series but thought I'll put it here because then people can't be bitching to me about " hey we have a thread for ex - Mets"...

Edgy DC Nov 04 2005 10:48 AM

Ok, does this mean bigger stories shouldn't go here or that this thread shouldn't exist? I mean, I really like to record it when Ricky Trlicek bowls a 300 game, but it won't make much of a thread. And such threads create clutter for archivists and become harder to find when you do want to find the story. I guess the answer is to use better judgment between what's a big story and what's a little one.

Willets Point Nov 04 2005 10:53 AM

The Moderators can split off posts to create new thread when topics fork so I don't see why we can't use our good judgement to do that in this thread when an ex-Met tid-bit engenders say five or more responses.

Frayed Knot Nov 04 2005 11:24 AM

metirish wrote: It's a good point Frayed Knot, I had wanted to start a thread about the Japan series but thought I'll put it here because then people can't be bitching to me about " hey we have a thread for ex - Mets"... See that's what I'm talking about. People are afraid to start new threads because they think they're breaking some kind of rule. Here are our rules: We don't have any! And even if we did I don't have any power to make them and no one's under any obligation to listen to me if I did. The only thing we're aiming for here is a liberal use of common sense. In other forums in other years there'd be posters that were either too lazy or too stupid to check to see what was already being discussed, or in other cases they'd be too enamored of seeing their handle under 'Thread Started By' that there'd be 6 different threads on the same page at the same time on the same topic. - Newsday says Mets Interested in Wagner - Daily News: Omar calls Wagner - Heyman thinks Wagner will stay in Philly - Hey, do you guys think we should go after Wagner? - Is Wagner a Free Agent? - etc, etc. At one point during heavy Sheffiield rumors I think there were 70-some different threads on some version of that same topic. The 'All Purpose' threads are merely a reaction to that kind of mess. But that doesn't mean that we should have thread Nazis policing every move. Do whatever you want and if someone hits you with a 'RMPL' response just take it in stride. Or you can tell them to STFU, whichever seems appropriate for that situation.. ]does this mean bigger stories shouldn't go here or that this thread shouldn't exist? The thread's fine and I probably shouldn't have said that I hated it, merely that I dislike what it's become. At some point a thread becomes so overgrown that it detracts from discussion rather than adds to it.

Elster88 Nov 04 2005 11:33 AM

]The only thing we're aiming for here is a liberal use of common sense. In other forums in other years there'd be posters that were either too lazy or too stupid to check to see what was already being discussed, or in other cases they'd be too enamored of seeing their handle under 'Thread Started By' that there'd be 6 different threads on the same page at the same time on the same topic. - Newsday says Mets Interested in Wagner - Daily News: Omar calls Wagner - Heyman thinks Wagner will stay in Philly - Hey, do you guys think we should go after Wagner? - Is Wagner a Free Agent? - etc, etc. At one point during heavy Sheffiield rumors I think there were 70-some different threads on some version of that same topic. I think a lot of people have gotten pissed off at stuff like this and go on the safe side just to avoid this exact situation. _____________________________ This post had the designation 129) Ron Hodges

Edgy DC Nov 04 2005 03:08 PM

Luis Rivera, coaching first for your Cleveland Indians. [url=http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051103&content_id=1264402&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]John Stearns[/url], expected to take over as manager for your Harrisburg Senators.

Edgy DC Nov 05 2005 12:18 PM

Bob Schaefer, former Jackson Mets and Tidewater Tides manager, was hired by the Atlanta Braves on Friday as a special assistant to general manager John Schuerholz.

Edgy DC Nov 06 2005 04:14 PM

[url=http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051106&content_id=1265054&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]Craig Shipley[/url], Australia's first Met is now a member of the Boston braintrust.

Edgy DC Nov 08 2005 09:01 PM

Calling games in Spanish for the Astros for the last ten years: Alex Trevińo.

Edgy DC Nov 09 2005 04:20 PM

Catching up with Davey Johnson.

seawolf17 Nov 09 2005 05:01 PM

Gary Carter (hugging Youppi) joins the NHL, along with Andre Dawson.

MFS62 Nov 09 2005 05:28 PM

Good ol' Gary. Why am I not surprised he made sure he was facing the camera? Later

Edgy DC Nov 10 2005 09:56 AM

FOOTBALL Feder resigns Saints job: The New Orleans announced Wednesday that senior director Mike Feder, a former Jackson Mets general manager, has resigned. Feder also served as executive director of the Arena Football League's New Orleans VooDoo. Feder issued a statement that read, in part: "The reason is simply irreconcilable differences. My philosophy appears to be different than that of the organization. It has become obvious that my opinion and experience are no longer needed." Feder joined the Saints as director of regional sales in 2001. His last responsibility was that of director of regional sales, overseeing the Baton Rouge sales and marketing efforts. News on Davey Johnson and Bobby Valentine comes up every day, and that's OK with me.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 10 2005 11:47 AM

It's like getting sawed off with a fastball of flavor! [url]http://www.nolanryanbeef.com/[/url]

OlerudOwned Nov 10 2005 12:49 PM

It was probably just an awkward shot, but that picture of Carter is freaking me out. Maybe I'm just crazy. BRAAAAAAIIIIIIINS!

Edgy DC Nov 10 2005 12:53 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 13 2005 10:19 PM

Do you generally fear combovers? What has become of the great Canadiens franchise that they have to borrow glitz from the defunct Expos?

Willets Point Nov 10 2005 12:58 PM

I see it more of Canada's social welfare system making sure that Youppi isn't out of the work and begging for loonies on Rue Sherbrooke.

ScarletKnight41 Nov 11 2005 03:05 PM

Thanks for the link JD. My parents are IMPOSSIBLE to shop for, and I think you've provided me with an excellent Chanukah present idea!

MFS62 Nov 11 2005 03:17 PM

I wonder if someone is marketing Jim Fregosi Turkey. Later

Edgy DC Nov 11 2005 05:32 PM

Guess who is varsity baseball coach at St. Louis's St. John Vianney High School.

MFS62 Nov 14 2005 07:56 AM

An exclusive front page story in today's Norwalk Advocate says that Bobby V is staying in Japan. http://www.norwalkadvocate.com/news/local/scn-sa-nor.valentine8nov14,0,5112124.story?coll=nor-news-local-headlines Later

Edgy DC Nov 14 2005 10:06 AM

I don't really want to rub this in, but I just got an e-mail from Steve Bieser.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 14 2005 10:09 AM

Reel him in!

Edgy DC Nov 14 2005 10:18 AM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 14 2005 10:35 AM

First things first. I asked him for a headshot in a Mets hat, and if there was any significance to him wearing 29. You've got to look after your peeps.

Johnny Dickshot Nov 14 2005 10:30 AM

Excellent. Now let's get Steve Henderson, Steve Dillon, Steve Trachsel, and Steve Phillips to join Steve Beiser and Steve Zabriskie in an All-Steve Q&A.

Edgy DC Nov 15 2005 12:53 PM

The Beeze is not getting back to me in a prompt manner. Before we introduce our next Rico, see if you can tell me which Mets holds the sad distinction of getting shut out in his first four big-league starts.

MFS62 Nov 15 2005 12:59 PM

Prentice Redman, we hardly knew ya'. He was signed to a minor league deal with the Cards. http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20051114&content_id=1268127&vkey=pr_stl&fext=.jsp&c_id=stl Later

Edgy DC Nov 15 2005 05:20 PM

]Before we introduce our next Rico, see if you can tell me which Mets holds the sad distinction of getting shut out in his first four big-league starts. Well, it's getting to the point like there's some sort of implicit agreement that all Edgy quizzes suck, therefore none shall participate. The answer is Jim McAndrew, of Lost Nation, Iowa.

seawolf17 Nov 15 2005 05:21 PM

Crap. I was just about to guess Jim McAndrew.

Edgy DC Nov 15 2005 05:23 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Nov 19 2005 08:54 PM

I wouldn't have accepted that answer without "of Lost Nation, Iowa."

Edgy DC Nov 16 2005 01:55 PM

"[url=http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051113&content_id=1267888&vkey=news_nym&fext=.jsp&c_id=nym]Gary's got nothing on me now[/url]."

MFS62 Nov 17 2005 12:51 PM

Some props for Tim Teufel: http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051113&content_id=1267888&vkey=news_nym&fext=.jsp&c_id=nym Later

Willets Point Nov 17 2005 12:57 PM

Deja vu.

Edgy DC Nov 17 2005 01:07 PM

Is it me?

MFS62 Nov 17 2005 01:29 PM

Oops, a classic RMPL moment. No, its wasn't you. It was moi. Thought your link was about The Kid. Later

metirish Nov 17 2005 01:36 PM

Cool story, congrats to Teufel,and damn cool to have the HR record for the Cape Cod league..

Valadius Nov 19 2005 04:06 PM

Hershiser moves into Rangers front office ARLINGTON, Texas (AP) -- Orel Hershiser resigned as pitching coach of the Texas Rangers on Friday to become the team's executive director. The move appeared to end Hershiser's rumored candidacy for the Los Angeles Dodgers' vacant managerial spot. Hershiser moves into the front office almost a month after Dodgers general manager Paul DePodesta said the Rangers granted him permission to speak with the former Dodgers pitcher about replacing Jim Tracy. The 47-year-old Hershiser joined the Rangers before the 2002 season as a special assistant to former general manager John Hart. He became the team's pitching coach in 2003 when Buck Showalter became manager. "When I became the pitching coach of the Rangers three years ago, I knew I was not going to be in that position for the long term," Hershiser said in a statement. "It is time for me to move onto different things in my life and (Rangers owner) Tom Hicks has provided me an opportunity to stay in the Dallas-Fort Worth area and with the Rangers." Mark Connor, who served the last three seasons as bullpen coach of the Rangers, becomes the team's pitching coach. Dom Chiti, formerly the club's director of player personnel, will replace Connor. The team also announced that Bobby Jones will return for his second stint as first base and outfield coach. Jones held the same spot in 2000 and '01 under former Rangers managers Johnny Oates and Jerry Narron. Jones was previously manager for the Rangers' Triple-A affiliate in Oklahoma.

Edgy DC Nov 20 2005 09:46 PM

Steve Walker, near Met. SABR guy recalls Richie Ashburn.

MFS62 Nov 21 2005 01:02 PM

If you recall a prior post, John Olerud Senior was going to play in the old fart World Series. Here's part of on email from him to my friend(11/14) at the Roy Hobbs WS in FL: *************************** “We won the opener (Sunday) 10-0 against a team from Rochester NY, I was 1-2 with 3 RBIs, a run scored and 2 assists on defense. Today (Monday) we beat a team from Akron OH, 12-5. I was 4-5 with 2 doubles, 2 RBIs and 2 runs scored. So far the body is holding up remarkably well for all the time I have been on base.” ************************************************** And, just found out today that John Sr.'s team won the whole thing. Them Oleruds sure can hit. Later

Edgy DC Nov 21 2005 04:25 PM

[url=http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051121&content_id=1271022&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]Steve Henderson[/url], new Devil Ray batting instructor.

Valadius Nov 22 2005 05:39 PM

Scott Strickland signed a minor league deal today with the Pittsburgh Pirates.

Edgy DC Nov 23 2005 08:14 AM

Scott Strickland has signed a minor league deal with the Pirates.

MFS62 Nov 23 2005 09:20 AM

I'm waiting for Valadius' "Is it me?" post. Later

Yancy Street Gang Nov 23 2005 09:24 AM

Maybe they both submitted their posts at the same time, and Edgy's took 15 hours to process. Me, I'm just wondering what Scott Strickland is up to these days. Anyone hear anything?

Edgy DC Nov 23 2005 09:45 AM

Actually, shit, that's close. I had other news in there, but I broke it off and put in another thread. Didn't realize I submitted that at all. Sorry.

Edgy DC Nov 26 2005 09:16 AM

Relations Kwiz: Basketballer Antoine Walker is related to which former Met?

Edgy DC Nov 27 2005 07:01 PM

I'm sorry, nobody buzzed in on time. Antoine is the nephew of former Met Chico Walker. Meanwhile, Mo Vaughn is getting involved in urban renewal.

DocTee Nov 27 2005 07:06 PM

I was gonna say that, but it seemed too obvious-- I was looking at the Chicago connection, since 'toine was born and raised in the Windy City.

Edgy DC Nov 29 2005 02:46 PM

nothing to report today except news on former minor-leaguers. B-Met Russ Triplett packs it in and returns to his alma mater. [url=http://tampabay.devilrays.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20051129&content_id=1273487&vkey=pr_tb&fext=.jsp&c_id=tb]John Tamargo[/url], former staple of Mets minor-league instructional staves, is taking over as manager of the Durham Bulls. OK, get real. Well, fine, I will. [url=http://thephatphree.com/features.asp?StoryID=1739&SectionID=2&LayoutType=1&StoryMonth=11&StoryYear=2005]Keith Hernandez[/url] has his very own curse named after him. Awesome.

Yancy Street Gang Nov 29 2005 03:03 PM

Meanwhile, the Mets have gone almost as long as the Cardinals without a World Championship. Who's the source of their curse? Ray Knight?

Edgy DC Nov 29 2005 03:05 PM

Kevin Mitchell or Ed Hearn.

Elster88 Nov 29 2005 03:07 PM

Don't read the article. I can sum it up for you. "Ha ha, Keith Hernandez did cocaine. Snort the baseline. Ha ha."

Willets Point Nov 29 2005 04:04 PM

[banging head on marble countertop]I know I posted about the Curse of Keith Hernandez a few months ago - linking a newspaper article - and questioned why Keith would curse the Cards to win two pennants at the expense of his team the Mets, but I can't find it anywhere in the archives! [/banging head on marble countertop]

metirish Nov 30 2005 09:32 AM

Kelly Stinnett will be the backup catcher to Posada says the Daily News.

sharpie Nov 30 2005 09:51 AM

Which would nullify the Mets-free Yankee team we had hoped for.

Rockin' Doc Nov 30 2005 12:58 PM

I'm fine with the Yankees signing Stinnett. As a matter of fact, I wish they would sign Cedeno for CF and Rodriguez for their bullpen too.

Edgy DC Nov 30 2005 03:09 PM

Dale Plummer, former Tide, is being passed off as a former Met. [url=http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/app/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051130&content_id=35281&vkey=pr_t461&fext=.jsp&sid=t461]Wally Whitehurst[/url] returns to the Eugene Emeralds for a second season as pitchign coach. Julio Santana signs what looks like a minor-league deal with Philly. Dwight Gooden, Rick Aguilera, and Orel Hershiser, you may have heard, are on the Hall of Fame ballot.

Valadius Nov 30 2005 03:11 PM

And Gregg Jefferies.

seawolf17 Dec 01 2005 09:41 AM

]Red Sox sue to keep ball that made '04 Series final out BOSTON -- The Red Sox have filed a lawsuit seeking a court order to keep the ball that Doug Mientkiewicz caught for the final out to clinch Boston's 2004 World Series title, The Boston Globe reported Thursday. Ownership of the ball has been in dispute during the 13 months since pitcher Keith Foulke flipped it to Mientkiewicz, giving Boston a four-game sweep of the St. Louis Cardinals and its first World Series championship in 86 years. Mientkiewicz, who clutched the ball in his glove and joined teammates in celebration, later put the ball in a safe deposit box and claimed ownership when the Red Sox asked for it. In January, days after he was traded to the New York Mets, he agreed to lend the ball to the Red Sox for one year. He would get it back "unless the ultimate issue of ownership has been otherwise resolved," the agreement said. That clause, The Boston Globe reported, led team lawyers to Suffolk Superior Court on Wednesday. The suit asks the court to place the ball in a "secure location" until ownership is decided. The team's lawyers argue that Mientkiewicz gained possession of the ball only because he was a Red Sox employee, and that the ball is team property. "From our perspective, it is very important that an artifact with this much history, it was 86 years in the making, be part of the club archive and be available for fans to experience," Lucinda Treat, the team's chief legal officer, told the newspaper. The Red Sox made quite a splash once they got the ball on Feb. 3, when it was driven to Fenway Park in a Brinks truck. The ball joined the World Series trophy on a tour of Massachusetts cities and towns. Neither Mientkiewicz nor the players' association were reached for comment, the Globe reported. When he agreed to lend the ball to the team, Mientkiewicz said: "I want the fans to see it, and that's what both the Red Sox and I agreed on." At that time, he said it was "very cordial, and we worked something out." He also said he "probably" would get the ball back after a year. Their agreement said proceeds directly derived from exhibiting the ball would be donated to the Red Sox Foundation, the team's charity organization. You had to know this would happen.

Edgy DC Dec 01 2005 09:56 AM

Bad form.

Elster88 Dec 01 2005 12:54 PM

The hell with Minky. A .235 hitter with a bad attitude to boot. Good luck getting that ball to the Sox.

Edgy DC Dec 01 2005 08:02 PM

Octavio Dotel is biding his time, entertaining suitors.

Zvon Dec 01 2005 08:42 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Octavio Dotel is biding his time, entertaining suitors. I think the Phils would be better off with Dotel, as opposed to Hoffman. Im hearin it from local Phils fans, and they are not happy with the Mets grabbin Wags. Nope,....not at all. I say tuff ti**ies, or something similar.

Nymr83 Dec 01 2005 08:46 PM

the danger with these surgeries seems to be coming back too soon. if i were a smart team i'd pay him 3/4 of a million to NOT pitch for them all year and then a normal salary for 2007 and an option with a buyout for 2008. someone could get a steal for 07/08 by gauranteeing him the money now while he is still in the recovery process.

Elster88 Dec 01 2005 10:07 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Octavio Dotel is biding his time, entertaining suitors. I hope the Mets are serious about asking him out. And we wouldn't even have to give up Benson for him.

Edgy DC Dec 03 2005 09:34 PM

Brett Butler gets a managerial gig. Bill Denehy could throw marshmallows through battleships, seriously.

Valadius Dec 04 2005 02:52 AM

Dotel won't be able to pitch until midseason. Would we take that risk?

Edgy DC Dec 05 2005 09:37 AM

Craig Shipley, coaching the Aussies. Tug McGraw, paid tribute to by Flash Gordon.

metirish Dec 05 2005 04:01 PM

[url=http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2248518]Byrd goes home[/url]

Yancy Street Gang Dec 05 2005 05:57 PM

Take this with a grain of salt, but Dyar Miller's ship may be about to come in

Edgy DC Dec 05 2005 10:12 PM

The manager of the Mexican team in the World Baseball Classic is to be Paquin Estrada, who, if that description is correct, is the same guy as Francisco Estrada.

Edgy DC Dec 07 2005 10:55 PM

Following David Wright catches you up with Keith Miller. That's two former Mets that have resurfaced representing current Mets.

Valadius Dec 08 2005 01:39 AM

DALLAS (AP) -- Joe McEwing and the Kansas City Royals agreed to a minor league contract on Wednesday. The utilityman batted .239 with one homer and six RBIs in 180 at-bats with the Royals last season. He played seven positions and served as a designated hitter. McEwing gets a $650,000 major league contract if he's added to Kansas City's 40-man roster next season.

Elster88 Dec 08 2005 08:56 AM

]served as a designated hitter. If Super Joe is EVER your DH then your team's got problems.

Edgy DC Dec 08 2005 09:45 AM

You'd figure ti could happen once. You know, a pinch-hitting situation where a tough lefty pitcher is coming in against a lefty batter vulnerable to them and Joe's the only available righthanded hitter. He had one appearance for the Mets at DH in 2001 (when he hit well) so I figured that it was something like that. But then I checked. He appeared at DH five times for the Royals this season.

metirish Dec 08 2005 01:25 PM

Kenny Rogers is taking his act to Detroit... ] BY JON HEYMAN STAFF WRITER December 8, 2005, 1:18 PM EST Kenny Rogers has agreed to sign a two-year, $16-million deal with the Detroit Tigers, Newsday has learned. Rogers, who pitched for the Yankees in 1996 and '97, went 14-8 with a 3.46 ERA for Texas last year. Rogers, 41, was an All-Star last year.

Yancy Street Gang Dec 08 2005 01:28 PM

What's with all these quartogenarians getting two-year deals?

Valadius Dec 08 2005 01:31 PM

Clemens and Berto, maybe?

MFS62 Dec 08 2005 01:41 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: What's with all these quartogenarians getting two-year deals? Watch those age cracks. Mole and I consider them kids. :) Later

MFS62 Dec 08 2005 02:02 PM

Bye Bye Ty http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.asp?sport=MLB&id=6930 Later

Yancy Street Gang Dec 08 2005 02:06 PM

I'm a quartogenarian myself, '62. It's funny how a 35-year-old baseball player seems old to me, but a 35-year-old I meet in person seems like a kid.

Yancy Street Gang Dec 08 2005 02:08 PM

Wow, Ty Wigginton released by the Pirates. He was a fun player, but I knew that too much was being made of sending him to Pittsburgh. He never seemed like a guy who'd be good enough to play regularly for a winning team. Now it looks like he's not even good enough to play for the Pirates.

MFS62 Dec 08 2005 02:09 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: I'm a quartogenarian myself, '62. It's funny how a 35-year-old baseball player seems old to me, but a 35-year-old I meet in person seems like a kid. LOL! I know the feeling. Later

Elster88 Dec 08 2005 02:19 PM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: Wow, Ty Wigginton released by the Pirates. He was a fun player, but I knew that too much was being made of sending him to Pittsburgh. He never seemed like a guy who'd be good enough to play regularly for a winning team. Now it looks like he's not even good enough to play for the Pirates. I can't fucking believe this. I recall continually hearing that the loss of Wigginton in the Benson deal was terrible. How could the Pirates cut him? I'm ripping on too many things. Happy thoughts.

metirish Dec 08 2005 02:25 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 08 2005 02:31 PM

I was pissed when Ty got traded, things never did work out for him there, wasn't he sent to the minors last season?

Valadius Dec 08 2005 02:27 PM

Yeah, he really stunk up the joint last year.

rpackrat Dec 08 2005 02:31 PM

Should the Mets consider Ty for a bench spot? IIRC, he can play 1B, 2B and 3B.

Valadius Dec 08 2005 02:33 PM

The Pirates released him to claim a player in the Rule V Draft... Ty Wigginton: Released by Pirates RotoWire.com Staff - RotoWire.com Thursday, December 8, 2005 Update: The Pirates officially released Wigginton to claim a player in the Rule 5 draft, which takes place Thursday, the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reports. Recommendation: Wigginton struggled with the Pirates after coming over in a 2004 trading deadline deal involving Kris Benson. Wigginton batted .258 in 57 games for Pittsburgh in 2005, hitting seven home runs and driving in 25 runs. He spent most of the season playing for Triple-A Indianapolis, where he hit .293 with 14 homers and 52 RBI.

metirish Dec 08 2005 02:40 PM

]Should the Mets consider Ty for a bench spot? IIRC, he can play 1B, 2B and 3B. Go for it,I'd like to see him back.

Valadius Dec 08 2005 02:42 PM

Either he comes back here or I'd love to see him join Bobby V, Benny Agbayani, and Matt Franco on the Marines.

Elster88 Dec 08 2005 02:43 PM

metirish wrote: I was pissed when Ty got traded Really, or is this a high SC? I never understood how losing Ty was a huge loss, except that at the time he was an option for first base for us and that it was fun to watch him steamroll catchers. That's more of a statement about the state of the Mets at the time then a statement that Ty is a quality major leaguer.

metirish Dec 08 2005 02:46 PM

I just liked the way he played, of course the Mets got back good players and Ty was never a great player, but I was pissed to see him leave, more for the person than the talent.

sharpie Dec 08 2005 02:58 PM

Signing Jose Valentin makes Wigginton a non-possibility.

Yancy Street Gang Dec 08 2005 02:59 PM

Not really. Valentin is just going to show up at spring training and compete for a job. Wigginton could do the same. (I don't expect it, but it's not outside the realm of possibility.)

heep Dec 08 2005 03:02 PM

Is anyone else bothered by the notion that Mets brass will not consider Wally Backman for the AA managerial position, after all the time he gave the organization? I am..

Valadius Dec 08 2005 03:05 PM

If he gets his personal life in order, then sure. That comes first.

Edgy DC Dec 08 2005 03:08 PM

]Is anyone else bothered by the notion that Mets brass will not consider Wally Backman for the AA managerial position, after all the time he gave the organization? It's not like (a) he really gave them his services, or (b) we have any evidence that he actually wasn't considered.

Johnny Dickshot Dec 08 2005 03:21 PM

Didn't we just see somewhere where he actually WAS being considered? edit answering my own question, yes... Daily News 12/7: The Mets have continued to speak with Wally Backman about their Double-A managerial opening, even though Backman - who is at the winter meetings - recently expressed pessimism they would extend an offer...

Yancy Street Gang Dec 08 2005 03:23 PM

We do know that the Mets were at least talking to him. Whether he was a serious candidate, or it was just a courtesy, is another matter.

Johnny Dickshot Dec 08 2005 03:31 PM

The news piece expresssing Backman's reservations, and presumably, heep's contention that the Mets are to be condemned for not talking to Backman, I would guess each relate to the Mark Healey interview linked and argued about here a month or so back.

smg58 Dec 09 2005 12:36 AM

Yancy Street Gang wrote: Wow, Ty Wigginton released by the Pirates. He was a fun player, but I knew that too much was being made of sending him to Pittsburgh. He never seemed like a guy who'd be good enough to play regularly for a winning team. Now it looks like he's not even good enough to play for the Pirates. In fairness to Wiggy, his numbers for last season in limited at-bats wound up being more or less in line with his career totals. A bigger problem resulted from the Pirates having too many young infielders fighting for spots, and the Pirates couldn't afford to keep playing the slumping player with other similarly qualified people fighting for time. He'll make a useful righty reserve for somebody, but he fills the same niche as Nady and now Julio Franco is probably coming too. If I were him I'd find a place with a more obvious need for him.

Valadius Dec 09 2005 02:02 PM

Todd Pratt goes from one division rival to another... Braves sign C Pratt to one-year contract ATLANTA (Ticker) - Unable to reach the postseason in the last 4 1/2 seasons with the Philadelphia Phillies, veteran Todd Pratt has joined a team with 14 consecutive division titles. On Friday, the Atlanta Braves signed the reserve catcher to a one-year contract. Financial terms were not disclosed, but Pratt made $750,000 with the Phillies in 2005. As the primary backup to Mike Lieberthal, Pratt batted .251 with seven homers and 23 RBI in 60 games this past season. His home run total was one shy of the career high he set in 2000, when he was a member of the National League-champion New York Mets. Pratt, who made his major league debut with Philadelphia in 1992, was re-acquired by the Phillies for fellow catcher Gary Bennett in July 2001. He has batted .255 in 600 career games with the Chicago Cubs, Mets and Phillies, who came within one game of the NL wild card in 2005. The Braves, who lost to the Houston Astros in the NL Division Series, on Wednesday traded catcher Johnny Estrada to Arizona. Brian McCann is expected to be Atlanta's starting catcher to begin the season.

metirish Dec 09 2005 02:06 PM

Good signing for the Braves, Pratt will help the kid.

smg58 Dec 10 2005 12:02 AM

Why Todd, why (sniff)?

Edgy DC Dec 10 2005 09:59 AM

Florida actually is signing some Major League players, bringing back Brian Moehler and Lenny Harris.

sharpie Dec 13 2005 02:53 PM

Mike DeFelice and Alberto Castillo both sign minor league deals with the Nats.

MFS62 Dec 13 2005 03:23 PM

DeFelice and Castillo gone? Sound like Scarlett's kid, Joe Hieptas might get a shot at AAA. Later

Valadius Dec 13 2005 09:08 PM

Tim Bogar the new manager at Class AA Akron... [url]http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-indians-bogar&prov=ap&type=lgns[/url]

Johnny Dickshot Dec 14 2005 04:54 PM

Former Met gets $12M loan for Brooklyn project Former New York Met Mo Vaughn and his company, Omni New York, will use a $12 million affordable housing loan from the city to buy and renovate two apartment buildings in Brooklyn. Omni will use the funds from the Housing Development Corp. to revamp 168 apartments in two buildings at 272 Pennsylvania Avenue and 2060 Pitkin Avenue in East New York, Brooklyn. Earlier this year, Omni used a $28.6 million HDC loan to buy and renovate nearly 300 low-income units in two buildings in the Bronx. HDC also approved $100.8 million in loans to help pay for the construction of six new buildings in the Bronx and an affordable housing development in Brooklyn that will contain 558 apartments for low income residents. Two affordable housing buildings, comprising 213 apartments, will get a $14 million loan from HDC to help with renovations and refinancing.

Edgy DC Dec 14 2005 06:48 PM

Yeah, I got news on that back in November. Pretty excellent that Mo is using Wilpon's money to go into Wilpon's business in Wilpon's borough, after first building in Steinbrenner's borough. I hope Steinbrenner lands on one of Mo's properties while he has a hotel on it, and then George'll have to mortgage all his holdings to pay Mo off.

Bret Sabermetric Dec 14 2005 07:07 PM

[Johnny Carson] May George Steinbrenner land on you after a heavy meal [/Johnny Carson]

metirish Dec 14 2005 07:39 PM

] FLORENCE, Italy -- Joe Torre carried the torch for the Turin Olympics on Wednesday -- after clearing it with his daughter. "The first person I had to ask was my daughter, because today is actually her 10th birthday," said the New York Yankees' manager, who ran 400 yards with the flame. Torre received the torch from Iowa native Brandon Routh, star of the upcoming "Superman Returns" movie, as part of an American day in the two-month relay. "I'm just glad he came down to my level for the handoff. There was no way I was going to get up to him," Torre said. Torre's segment ended at the foot of the famous Ponte Vecchio bridge. He was cheered on by a mix of Italians and Americans, some yelling, "We love you, Joe." "It was dynamite," Torre said. "I wasn't sure if I was going to make it, but it was really great." Torre's mother was born in the small town of Patina near Naples. "That also made this a wonderful invitation for us to come back to take part in the relay," Torre said. "Italy is a special place. I haven't been in Italy for 20 years, but it left some indelible memories in my mind. "Today, I've only been here a few hours so far, and I've already seen some Yankees fans around the hotel. You don't have to be a baseball fan to know who the New York Yankees are. That is something I've learned in my 10 years there." The torch relay ends at the opening ceremony in Turin on Feb. 10. It began in Rome last week. "There is a great deal of spirit that goes along with participating in the Olympics, no matter what minor role you might play," Torre said.

Edgy DC Dec 15 2005 03:27 PM

Rick Sweet is reupped by the Louisville Bats.

Yancy Street Gang Dec 15 2005 03:32 PM

I'm glad I didn't run into Joe Torre when I was in Florence last year. It would have been a real buzzkill.

Edgy DC Dec 16 2005 10:47 AM

Don't say Bob Friend stunk, 'cuz he didn't

Willets Point Dec 16 2005 11:26 AM

Joe Torre is now an African man with a prominent Nike swoosh.

Edgy DC Dec 16 2005 11:29 AM

]"Today, I've only been here a few hours so far, and I've already seen some Yankees fans around the hotel. You don't have to be a baseball fan to know who the New York Yankees are. That is something I've learned in my 10 years there." Heck, some would say you don't have to be a baseball fan to be a season-ticket holder showing up 81 times a year at Yankee Stadium.

MFS62 Dec 20 2005 06:06 PM

Octavio Dotel signs with the Yanks, as reported a few minutes ago on WFAN. No contract details given. LAter

Willets Point Dec 20 2005 06:08 PM

He's dead to me now. Joe Torre, btw, now looks like Tiger Woods.

ScarletKnight41 Dec 20 2005 06:09 PM

We took to calling him D'Oh-tel when he pitched with the A's. He really stunk up the joint in Oakland.

MFS62 Dec 20 2005 06:27 PM

And Orber Moreno is now an Oriole. http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/transactions/today.html Later

Rockin' Doc Dec 21 2005 01:16 PM

Scarlet "We took to calling him D'Oh-tel when he pitched with the A's. He really stunk up the joint in Oakland." Well, I certainly hope he regains his recent form while in the Bronx.

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 01:24 PM

Edgy DC wrote: Don't say Bob Friend stunk, 'cuz he didn't Who thought that? He was a key starter during the season for the Bucs when they beat the MFYs in '60, and for that he should have a special place in the hearts of baseball fans everywhere. He and Vern Law made for a tough 1-2 tandem for a number of years. I also remember that he was constantly being accused of throwing the "dewy delivery". :) Later

Edgy DC Dec 21 2005 01:27 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 21 2005 01:48 PM

The author and the headline writer ("Friend’s record deceiving") seem to work from the position that Friend is under-appreciated.

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 01:37 PM

Edgy DC wrote: The author and the headline writer ("Friend’s record deceiving") seem to work from the position that Frield is under-appreciated. There's a big difference between saying someone is underappreciated and they stink. There are many pitchers who have toiled for bad teams who have career losing records. But I wouldn't have wanted to bat against any of them. From a standpoint of stuff and style, I would compare Friend to Steve Traschell, maybe better. Mole, can you help me out here? Later

Edgy DC Dec 21 2005 01:47 PM

Yes, noboody is actually saying that he stinks. You're right. I was overstating the point of the article to the level of obscurity --- not that unlike the original "Rico Brogna, Good Fit" title, which you also didn't get --- as a way of creating curiosity about the content of the link. I think that should be clear.

MFS62 Dec 21 2005 02:00 PM

Yes, I got it. But I was admonished (maybe too strong a word, reminded?) by Scarlett a while back when I was titling my new threads with things that I thought might be intriguing enough to make people want to open them. She suggested (ah, that's the better word) that when decisions are being made as to what threads will get archived, the title should be easier to understand. You're right, this was not a thread title, but a link title. But given the article itself, I just felt that "stink" was too strong. (no pun intended) And, I have tried to be careful posting things to the appropriate threads. Sometimes I have to look back a few pages to find the correct one. Later

Willets Point Dec 21 2005 02:02 PM

It's like that thread title "Bec requests oral sex from Doc".

mlbaseballtalk Dec 21 2005 08:42 PM

Old friend Edgardo Alfonzo is on the move. Traded to California Angels of Los Angeles, in Orange County, city of Anaheim for Steve Finley [url]http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051221&content_id=1286132&vkey=hotstove2005&fext=.jsp[/url]

smg58 Dec 21 2005 09:21 PM

I was really angry when the Mets let Fonzie go, but other than the second half of the 03 season (and that playoff series with the Marlins where he was the only Giant who showed up), he's been a big disappointment. Maybe the change of venue will do him some good. Of course the same is true for Finley. The deal makes sense for both clubs, but I don't know if either side will really benefit much, as neither player may have anything left in the tank.

G-Fafif Dec 21 2005 10:05 PM

smg58 wrote: I was really angry when the Mets let Fonzie go, but other than the second half of the 03 season (and that playoff series with the Marlins where he was the only Giant who showed up), he's been a big disappointment. Maybe the change of venue will do him some good. Of course the same is true for Finley. The deal makes sense for both clubs, but I don't know if either side will really benefit much, as neither player may have anything left in the tank. The Angels are on Matsui's very limited trade list. Maybe the disappointing contract for disappointing contract dream (mine anyway) lives. I've never stopped missing Alfonzo though I ceased obsessing on him last year. I'd feel a little more secure about things with Fonzie as a better Cairo and a Hernandez/Keppinger (choose one) worked in at 2B. Finley presumably will get at least one big hit against us some late San Francisco night.

mlbaseballtalk Dec 22 2005 08:59 AM

Matt Lawton is sorry, in more ways than one! [url]http://www.usatoday.com/sports/bbw/columnist/nightengale/2005-12-21-majors_x.htm[/url] ]Lawton awaits forgiveness for miscue Matt Lawton was petrified. The playoffs were about to start. His shoulder ached. His ankle throbbed. And he wasn't playing worth a darn for the Yankees. Matt Lawton's only highlight in pinstripes was this home run against Baltimore the day after he took a steroid injection. By Julie Jacobson, AP Cortisone shots no longer worked for him, and no trainer had any magical cure. So Lawton says he talked to friends and teammates and then made a telephone call that he will regret forever. "It was such a stupid thing, but I was desperate," Lawton told Sports Weekly during his first interview since being suspended 10 days by Major League Baseball for violating its steroids policy. "Maybe it was the pressure of playing in New York, I don't know. I never had the urge to take any of that stuff before, but I was talking to some guys, and they guaranteed it would get the pain out." Lawton, who says he had always taken pride in being clean and that he had never even taken amphetamines, was injected with the veterinary steroid boldenone. "I wasn't playing well enough to be on a Little League roster, let alone be on the roster of the New York Yankees," Lawton said. "I just wasn't physically able to do the job. I had never been in the playoff hunt before. So I did something that will always haunt me." Lawton says the steroid injection is one of the primary reasons why he remains unemployed as a free agent outfielder. He realizes that he also didn't help himself this past season by batting only .254 with 13 homers and 53 RBI between the Pirates, Cubs and Yankees. He hated being with the Pirates before they traded him to Chicago. He never was healthy for the month he played for the Cubs before they dealt him to the Yankees. And he certainly wasn't ready for New York. "If I could, I'd call the Pirates, the Cubs and the Yankees and apologize," said Lawton, who hit .125 in 21 games with the Yankees. "I wasn't myself. I wanted to play well, and then, all of a sudden, you get traded to the ultimate, the big stage in New York. If you don't produce there, you're out. I had a short rope and didn't get the job done. "Everything was going so bad all I thought about was retiring. Well, I don't want to retire anymore. I want to play. I'm healthy. And I'm hungry." Lawton, an All-Star in 2000 and 2004, realizes that no one likely will sign him for more than $1.5 million. But that's fine. He could never work another day in his life and be fine with his savings and investments from his 11-year career. The 34-year-old just wants to experience the postseason at least once in his career. "I don't want people to think that everything I did, the good years I had, were steroid-related," Lawton said. "I learned a lot about myself last year, and I'll be better for it. "Now I'm ready to prove it." Lawton still has difficulty digesting what he did. He says he endured enormous pain in telling his family — particularly his mother, Lynette — about it. All that anguish for one lousy game. "That's what really gets him," said Kevin Kohler, Lawton's agent. "He told me, 'Hey, if I did it all season and hit 30 home runs, it would be something different.' But one game! That's what kills him. "He was willing to do absolutely anything to be on that playoff roster." Lawton took the steroid injection Sept. 20 in New York. Because he hadn't been tested for steroids all season, he figured he was safe. Lawton showed up at Yankee Stadium the next day and learned he was starting in center field. He took batting practice and couldn't believe the difference. He felt no pain. He drove the ball to all fields. He hit the ball into the seats. Lawton recalls Yankees manager Joe Torre joking, "Where did this guy come from?" In the lineup for the first time in a week, Lawton hit a home run off Orioles starting pitcher Rodrigo Lopez in his first at-bat. He went 2-for-3 with two RBI. The Yankees won 2-1 to move past the Red Sox into first place. "It was weird, after that one shot, I felt fresh again," Lawton said. "Maybe it was mental, I don't know, but the ball started jumping off my bat again. I suddenly had oomph." The next day, MLB tested Lawton for steroids. He had only three more at-bats the rest of the season, and the Yankees left him off their playoff roster. "It was like, 'Dang, just my luck,' " Lawton said. "They had me. It was so stupid. I'm a guy who never took that stuff before in my life. I wasn't doing it for strength or trying to hit home runs. I had 13 home runs during the year. I was just doing it because I had so much pain. And then, 'Bam.' I'm still paying for it." When MLB officials asked Lawton to resubmit a urine sample, he declined. He knew he was guilty. Now, Lawton wants to atone for his mistake and show the baseball world that he can still be an All-Star outfielder. He never has been a home run hitter, but he's a .267 career hitter with a lifetime .368 on-base percentage. He can run, he can play defense and he has always been considered a model teammate. Kohler says several teams have contacted Lawton about playing for them in 2006. "It's a blessing to me to have just played one day in the major leagues," Lawton said. "But I'm not ready to give it up yet. I know I have a few years left. But if teams don't feel the same way I do, I can't change that. "What I really don't want is to be remembered just for what I did last year." —- Bob Nightengale covers the major leagues for USA TODAY Sports Weekly. You can e-mail him at: bnightengale@usatoday.com.

Edgy DC Dec 22 2005 09:16 AM

Playing for the Yankees leads to drug abuse. Got it.

MFS62 Dec 22 2005 09:29 AM

Edgy DC wrote: Playing for the Yankees leads to drug abuse. Got it. Y'mean Giambi spent all those years in Oakland getting ready to be a Yankee some day? Later

Edgy DC Dec 22 2005 02:55 PM Edited 1 time(s), most recently on Dec 22 2005 03:23 PM

[url=http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051222&content_id=1286333&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb]Astounding tale of Barry Lyons[/url]. This isn't a distortion. It truly is astounding. Some good Randy Myers material in there also.

MFS62 Dec 22 2005 03:13 PM

Wow! Its great to hear that Barry is getting back on his feet and that MLB/BAT is helping him do it. But why did Marty Noble have to use on word, "notorious"? He got his start at Newsday. I wonder which tabloid he was referring to? That one word spoiled an otherwise good piece. Later

Johnny Dickshot Dec 22 2005 03:16 PM

(Gotham baseball) Readers deserve to know what an embarrassing hack Marty Noble has become.(/Gotham baseball)

Edgy DC Dec 22 2005 03:28 PM

If I recall correctly, that Newsday backpage headline read "The Lyons Roars." A salvage-worthy moment, but a drown-worthy pun.

Edgy DC Dec 23 2005 10:13 AM

The Italian entry in the World Baseball Classic is looking as Metly as any of the other squads --- US, Puerto Rico, Dominican. Matt Galante has been hired to manage the team, and John Franco is his pitching coach.

Bret Sabermetric Dec 23 2005 10:49 AM

According to this http://www.baseball-reference.com/a/alfoned01.shtml the Mets paid 21 Million dollars for 8 seasons of good Alfonzo (.800+ OPS) and the Giants have paid almost that much (18 Mil) for three seasons of bad Alfonzo (below .730 OPS), yet some people are still upset the Mets let him go when they did. This goes near the top of my checklist of "How to tell if you're more interested in the Mets winning or on some totally insane nostalgia-driven ego-trip having nothing to with winning baseball: Question one--Does the Mets' choice to let Alfonzo go after 2002 make you now feel A) Deeply angry B) Betrayed C) Regretful D) Nothing E) Deliriously Happy" Question 2: "Did the Mets' choice to let Alfonzo go after 2002 make you feel at that time: A) Deeply angry B) Betrayed C) Regretful D) Nothing E) Deliriously Happy" Give yourself 5 points for every A answer, 4 for a B etc.

smg58 Dec 23 2005 11:50 PM

D to the first question and A to the second. The Giants gave Alfonzo what I thought he was worth at the time. His 2002 season was better than people realize -- he had a .391 OBP, his OPS was within 10 points of Rolen and Chavez, and he had something like a .330 BA with RISP, so the people who complained about his RBI total should have blamed the rest of the Mets' lineup, which for reasons I still can't explain was kept intact. I would never have picked up Alomar's option at Alfonzo's expense, and would have sent Fonzie back to second. In hindsight it wouldn't have worked out; I don't think he'd have slumped at the start of 03, but otherwise the decline would have been the same. Then again, Alfonzo wouldn't have given that infield position any less production than the Mets have gotten from it the past three seasons, so the Mets haven't benefited from it any more than they've been hurt by it.

Edgy DC Dec 25 2005 12:05 PM

I think the New York tabloids are pretty notorious. Meanhile, Rick Reed: If ever a hiring made sense, it was Rick Reed returning to Marshall as pitching coach. The former Thundering Herd pitcher from Huntington enjoyed a 17-year professional baseball career while maintaining a residence in Proctorville, Ohio with wife Dee. When the position became available, Marshall baseball coach Dave Piepenbrink sought out one of the Thundering Herd's favorite sons. Reed stressed conditioning upon his return and is expected to impact both on-field performance and recruiting. He played in both the 1998 and 2001 All-Star Games and helped lead the New York Mets to a World Series appearance.

Rockin' Doc Dec 25 2005 02:13 PM

Should be a great addition to the Marshall baseball program. Man do I feel old. I played against Marshall in college, but Rick Reed's tenure with the Thundering Herd began the season after I had left to start graduate school. It would really have been a great memory had I got to face Reed in college. It would be great to be able to tell people, "That guy struck me out in college."

MFS62 Dec 26 2005 10:10 AM

Rockin' Doc wrote: Man do I feel old. I played against Marshall in college, but Rick Reed's tenure with the Thundering Herd began the season after I had left to start graduate school. It would be great to be able to tell people, "That guy struck me out in college." Doc, if you feel old, how should I feel? I pitched against Larry Bearnarth in College. And he hit a home run off me that's still going. :( Later

Rockin' Doc Dec 26 2005 08:11 PM

Well, how did you do in your at bat against Bearnarth? What did you do in his next at bat against you?

MFS62 Dec 27 2005 07:46 AM

I fanned in both my at bats against him. In his other at bats, he hit ropes. One single and one damn near killed our shortstop. In those pre-draft days, while the Mets were interested in Larry as a pitcher, the Red Sox made him an offer to be an outfielder. That's how well he could hit. Later.

Frayed Knot Dec 27 2005 09:49 AM

]Man do I feel old. I played against Marshall in college I think my cousin (cousin in-law actually) did some pitching for Marshall. He's probably right about your age too.

mlbaseballtalk Dec 28 2005 05:17 PM

Sideways With Seaver From the 12/28 Dinning section of the New York Times ]Warming Up in the Vineyard, Tom Terrific By ERIC ASIMOV Published: December 28, 2005 CALISTOGA, Calif. WITH a cup of hot coffee, Tom Seaver took an early morning stroll recently through his secluded three-acre vineyard on Diamond Mountain just south of this rustic Napa Valley town. As he stared at the cabernet sauvignon vines, which had just been harvested of grapes the day before, he said, a sense of sadness and loss came over him. "It was the weirdest feeling, like postpartum depression - I'd never had that feeling before," he said, looking at leaves now yellowing in the cool air. "There are 3,980 plants, and I've named every one of them."' Almost 40 years have passed since Mr. Seaver first took the mound at Shea Stadium, back when the Mets were baseball's hapless losers. He led them to their first World Series victory in 1969 and won 311 games in his 20-year Hall of Fame career. Today, he's a little over his playing weight and more weathered in the face. The boyish Tom Terrific features are still there, but he wears a pair of pruning shears on his belt rather than a glove on his hand. The intensity that fueled him on the mound now is focused on his hillside vineyard, 800 feet above the valley floor and framed by towering redwoods and the twisted, sculptural lines of manzanita trees. The 2005 harvest, to be released in three years, is the first vintage of what will, despite his reluctance, be called Seaver. "I wanted to keep my name off of it, so the wine could make its own name," Mr. Seaver recalled. "My daughter said, 'Dad, you're not living forever. Your grandchildren will be running it one day. You're putting your name on it.' " Tom Seaver is not the first celebrity to be drawn to the wine business. Some are born to it, like Gérard Depardieu, the French actor who came from a winemaking family. Others, like Francis Ford Coppola, the director, and Greg Norman, the golfer, are wine-loving entrepreneurs who have become serious businessmen. Many, like Carlos Santana or Joe Montana, lend their name or marketing prowess to raise money for charities. And some are simply inscrutable, like Bob Dylan, who has signed his name without explanation to Planet Waves, a red wine made by Le Terrazze in the Marche region of Italy. But few take as much pleasure as Mr. Seaver in the gritty, callous-building, hands-on labor of raising grapes. With only three acres planted, Seaver wine will be a small business, which fits with the desire of its proprietor. Mr. Seaver predicts the first vintage will yield about 450 cases - 5,400 bottles - the equivalent of one of the smallest of Napa's cult wineries. While plans for distributing the wine have not yet solidified, Mr. Seaver is already putting together a mailing list of potential buyers who he thinks will appreciate his efforts (GTS Vineyards, Box 888, Calistoga, Calif. 94515). "I had a guy in New Jersey say, 'I'll take everything you have,' " he said. "That's not why I'm doing this. It's part of sharing the joy of creation." The glamour of the wine business, the slick image-building that has made Napa Valley a synonym for a pseudo-Mediterranean Eden known as "the good life," holds little interest for him. For Mr. Seaver and his wife, Nancy, the idea of going out for a meal means not being seen at French Laundry but rather grabbing a sandwich in Calistoga with his dogs or maybe driving the pickup down to St. Helena for breakfast at Gillwoods. "I must confess, my heart lies in the vineyard," he said. "This is where the physical stuff is." Not that the Seavers are rubes or hermits. They live in a sleek contemporary house that practically fades into the hillside, designed by Kenneth Kao, a Boston architect. Its ruddy steel posts and copper roof mimic the color of the manzanita trees and redwoods, while the beige shotcrete walls seem to merge with the stony white of the soil. Inside, antiquities and colonial woodworks coexist happily with Bauhaus furniture and modern art. There's a wine cellar, of course, a vegetable garden and a greenhouse for Nancy, who is a serious gardener. But for sheer take-your-breath-away beauty, nothing compares with the spectacular, panoramic view of the northern Napa Valley, with Mount St. Helena looming in the distance, and Three Palms Vineyard down below. When the Seavers first saw the land in 1998, it was 115 acres of trees and brush. "If you stood here, you couldn't see 15 feet," he said, standing behind the house, overlooking a terraced garden. "We never knew. The view exploded on us." Skip to next paragraph Associated Press Mr. Seaver in 1969, pitching for the Mets. Forum: Wine and Spirits Seaver grew up in Fresno, Calif., in the heart of the Central Valley, where his father was in the raisin business. Once, at the height of his baseball career, his brother-in-law asked him what he was going to do when it was all over. "Off the top of my head, I said, 'I want to go back to California and raise grapes,' " he said. "I didn't know that much about it, except that's what I wanted to do." That dream waited until their two daughters, Sarah and Annie, were out of college and the Seavers were ready to leave the renovated barn in Greenwich, Conn., where they had lived for 30 years. They settled on the appropriately named Diamond Mountain, a district known best for the tannic, concentrated cabernet sauvignons produced by Diamond Creek Vineyards. Mr. Seaver had originally wanted to plant a vineyard close to his house, but Nancy preferred that the trucks and other vineyard equipment be out of sight. So he bought a couple of tree-covered slopes that face south and southeast, exactly the sort of land that winemakers dream about. On the recommendation of Rusty Staub, his former teammate and a longtime wine lover, Mr. Seaver hired Jim Barbour as his vineyard manager. "He said, 'How the hell did you find this? This is what people are searching all over for,' " Mr. Seaver recalled about Mr. Barbour's reaction to the vineyard's location. "It's pure luck that my wife said no." He said he is not in the business for the money. He will not say what his investment has been other than that it will be seven years from the initial planting before the first bottle of wine is sold. But if the wine is good and people are willing to pay, say, $60 or more a bottle, a business like this can certainly be profitable. Mr. Seaver discovered wine in his college days at the University of Southern California. But what really sparked his interest, he said, was a series of bicycle trips he and Nancy took in the off-seasons through the great wine areas of France and Italy. Ask him to name a memorable bottle and he says: "We were riding in Burgundy and we stopped at a farm. We asked if we could taste their wine - it was just small production. You buy a couple of bottles, put it in your bag and have it with dinner that night. There's nothing like it." He allows that he particularly likes zinfandel. In fact, when it came time to plant his vineyard, he imagined it would be with zinfandel, at least until he raised the question with Mr. Barbour, who gently reminded him that Diamond Mountain was cabernet country. "I wanted to do a zin, and Jim said, 'You have a place like this, you don't grow zin!' I said, 'Yes, sir!' " The cabernet vines were all planted by 2002, and Mr. Seaver has been out there each step of the way, learning from the vineyard workers the delicate arts of pruning and trellising. "Step by step, the learning process has fascinated me," he said. "I walk with them and it's like being in a classroom." Mr. Seaver hired a winemaker, Thomas Brown, who also makes Outpost zinfandels, wines that Mr. Seaver has long admired. Mr. Brown will make the wine using the Outpost facilities. It didn't hurt that Mr. Brown's great-uncle is Bobby Richardson, who used to play second base for the Yankees. As Mr. Seaver walks his property he seems to know every inch of terrain. He's mentally mapped the location of each tree that's caught his fancy, marveling at the way a manzanita has gnarled and arced its way out of the shadow of a Douglas fir, or at the aroma of a bay tree. "You're in awe of the stuff," he said. "You realize how small you are, and in the sense of time, too." If baseball brings out the little kid in a man, so apparently, do trees and vineyards. "The day he found this property he got poison oak climbing trees to see the vista," Rusty Staub said. "He's so locked into that vineyard. It was really a genius thing on his part." Mr. Brown characterizes the wine, which has only recently completed its initial fermentation, as extreme. "It's a wine that seems to have a lot of baby fat," he said. "It's super, super dark and just very, very dense." Most likely, he said, the 2005 will not be bottled until the spring of 2007 and not released for another year after that. Mr. Seaver said the only direction he's given Mr. Barbour and Mr. Brown is to do the best they can with what the vineyard offers. "I don't care about quantity, and I don't care about making the best wine in the world," he said. "I just want to make the best wine we can from that vineyard."

ScarletKnight41 Dec 28 2005 05:21 PM

Now I know what I'm buying for my parents for Chanukah 2008 - a bottle of Seaver wine (says the woman who bought them Nolan Ryan beef this year).

Zvon Dec 28 2005 05:26 PM

great article.^ most enjoyable read. thanks for posting this mlbaseballtalk

Edgy DC Dec 28 2005 08:10 PM

Once and future Crane Pooler pays tribute to John Olerud.

Johnny Dickshot Dec 28 2005 08:25 PM

Future?

Edgy DC Dec 28 2005 08:50 PM

I dunno. It happens. The tarot cards say what they say. I'm just the messenger.

Edgy DC Dec 30 2005 01:23 PM

This article --- reporting that Terrel Hansen, among others, has been inducted into the Chico Professional Baseball Hall of Fame --- claims that Hansen got a brief callup with the Mets in 1992. Could he one of the Todd Self-types --- phantom Mets who've appeared on the roster but never in a game?

Johnny Dickshot Dec 30 2005 01:44 PM

yup.

MFS62 Dec 30 2005 01:44 PM

I remember Hansen. He was a Prentice Redman-type- pretty good in the minors looking for a break in the majors. Here's all they have on him at the baseball cube: http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/H/terrel-hansen.shtml Later

Edgy DC Dec 30 2005 01:52 PM

There should be a listing somewhere, if not on the UMDB, of all phantom Mets. I actually have used the term in the past to describe players like Jim Kern and David Justice, acquired by the Mets and then flipped in a later deal during the offseason. But that's a different animal. We need two different terms. It's unclear if Self was ever even in the Mets dugout, but he was apparently on the big-league roster.

MFS62 Dec 30 2005 02:12 PM

Edgy DC wrote: There should be a listing somewhere, if not on the UMDB, of all phantom Mets. I actually have used the term in the past to describe players like Jim Kern and David Justice, acquired by the Mets and then flipped in a later deal during the offseason. Don't forget Joe Randa when you compile that list. He was a Met for about a week in December 1998. Later

mlbaseballtalk Dec 30 2005 11:20 PM

Edgy DC wrote: There should be a listing somewhere, if not on the UMDB, of all phantom Mets. I actually have used the term in the past to describe players like Jim Kern and David Justice, acquired by the Mets and then flipped in a later deal during the offseason. But that's a different animal. We need two different terms. It's unclear if Self was ever even in the Mets dugout, but he was apparently on the big-league roster. UMDB lists Jerry Moses, Jim Bibby and Glenn Davis in the FAQ (Jerry Moses actually gets an FAQ question) Or how about the case of Steve Rosenberg who was put on the 60 Day DL in Spring Training of 1992, and wasn't resigned for 1993 . Sports Encylopedia: Baseball (Neft & Cohen, I think Temple publishes them ) lists players on DLs for entire seasons and Rosenberg is on the Met roster for 1992 despite never playing a single meaningfull game for the Met organization Steve

mlbaseballtalk Dec 30 2005 11:22 PM

Edgy DC wrote: This article --- reporting that Terrel Hansen, among others, has been inducted into the Chico Professional Baseball Hall of Fame --- claims that Hansen got a brief callup with the Mets in 1992. Could he one of the Todd Self-types --- phantom Mets who've appeared on the roster but never in a game? I heard he had an interesting quip about it (well I got it from Howie Rose) where instead of a "cup of coffee" it was more like "a sip" or something

Johnny Dickshot Dec 30 2005 11:34 PM

While there's been a number of guys who didn't play during a certain stretch of Met rosterdom, AFAIK, there have been only (six) guys on the active Met roster in season who NEVER played for the team, not enough to fill an Iowa cornfield: P Jim Bibby 1969 and 1971 C Randy Bobb 1970 C Jerry Moses 1975 OF Terrell Hansen 1992 P Mac Suzuki 1999 1B Todd Self 2005 edit: Does Self "count"? I know he was a 40-man roster guy, and in uniform, but was he like, eligible to play?

Edgy DC Dec 31 2005 08:30 AM

He was reported to be on the major-league roster. Are you asking if he was healthy and in his cleats?

Edgy DC Dec 31 2005 08:30 AM

By the way, this thread gets honorably retired tonight.

OlerudOwned Dec 31 2005 01:06 PM

26 pages, very fitting.

Willets Point Jan 09 2006 10:57 AM

Why is this thread archived?!?! It should be kept alive for all time!!!!

metirish Jan 22 2006 12:40 AM

Sorry to bring this thread back but the Seaver article was great, I'll buy a few bottles....