Holy @#%$!

[Frayed Knot]

I don't care what Cohen spends either. But if he starts making a habit of bad deals for the sheer splash of it then his is not going to be any more of a successful run than was the Wilpon's.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I'd bet anything that Cohen is going to shatter the Wilpons' record of, what was it, two first place finishes in 32 seasons? And by shatter, I mean in a good way. The Wilpons made plenty of bad deals by being frugal. In fact, there's a strong correlation there. You tend to get what you pay for.

In just two full seasons, Cohen's Mets already have one division title. And a 101-win season, the second most one-season wins in franchise history.

[Edgy MD]

The good news is that there are plenty of places to bet.

[batmagadanleadoff]

The good news is that there are plenty of places to bet.

I was mainly responding to this:

...if [Cohen] starts making a habit of bad deals for the sheer splash of it then his is not going to be any more of a successful run than was the Wilpon's.

Everybody makes bad deals. Even when they spend. The future is unknowable. Jason Bay was an unmitigated disaster and that might've been the most expensive Madoff-era deal the Wilpons made. Ditto David Wright's last contract.

Cohen will be more successful than the Wilpons. I don't see how not, unless Cohen gets run over by a freight train in the near future. And even then, it will be because Cohen didn't have a chance, not because he was inept and a micromanaging meddler.

[Edgy MD]

None of those claims make this the right move if it's not.

Of course the future is unknowable, which you state even as you make another statement about the future that, aside from being beside the point, you make with such certainty that you can't possibly see any other outcome.

[batmagadanleadoff]

None of those claims make this the right move if it's not.

What's your point? That a Correa signing could turn out badly? I agree. Where did I say otherwise? I simply think that it's a lot easier to recover from your mistakes when you're one of the richest guys on the whole damn planet. I'm sure Jeff Bezos doesn't have to worry at all about buying a brand new top of the line automobile that turns out to be a lemon.

Of course the future is unknowable, which you state even as you make another statement about the future that, aside from being beside the point, you make with such certainty that you can't possibly see any other outcome.

Because I feel certain. Of course, I could be wrong. Of course the Wilpons' reign could turn out to be more successful than Cohen's will. But not bloody likely so long as Cohen is given a reasonable chance.

What's your point here? I'm not allowed to have an opinion?


What's the point of this whole exchange? That the Correa deal could turn out badly for the Mets? And that then what? That Cohen should never sign another free agent? That if the Correa deal turns out to be a bad deal for the Mets, every other deal Cohen makes from here on out is also gonna turn bad? That it'd then be likely that the Wilpons will have been the more successful Mets owners when it's all said and done if the Mets sign Correa and the deal goes bad?

If Correa turns into another Jason Bay, you wanna know what'll probably happen? Cohen'll probably eat Correa's salary and move on to the next third baseman. And the more I think of this, as I write it out in this here post, the more I hope that that's exactly what ends up happening so I can get to see it and read all the nutty takes about how much money Cohen's spending even though Correa's annual Mets salary is like one annual trip to Burger King for lunch for someone like me and by the time Correa's deal goes bad, if it ever does, Cohen'll probably have another two billion dollars to his name in addition to what he already has.

[Edgy MD]

My point is certainly clear. The subject of the thread is this deal.

We know, certainly, that Steve Cohen is fabulously rich.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I'd bet anything that Cohen is going to shatter the Wilpons' record of, what was it, two first place finishes in 32 seasons? And by shatter, I mean in a good way. The Wilpons made plenty of bad deals by being frugal. In fact, there's a strong correlation there. You tend to get what you pay for.

In just two full seasons, Cohen's Mets already have one division title. And a 101-win season, the second most one-season wins in franchise history.

Correction: No division titles yet. It sure felt like there was one when I wrote that post.

[Fman99]

I need an update or my brain is going to implode like a neutron star.

[metirish]

Update of sorts

[batmagadanleadoff]

None of those claims make this the right move if it's not.

Of course the future is unknowable, which you state even as you make another statement about the future that, aside from being beside the point, you make with such certainty that you can't possibly see any other outcome.

My point is certainly clear. The subject of the thread is this deal.

We know, certainly, that Steve Cohen is fabulously rich.

I thought I was being on point all along and staying on the subject of the thread - the Mets Correa deal. I'll explain.

We'll start with this post:

Yes it will, and maybe not signing Correa will ultimately be the better move given the MONEYBALL adage about it being easier to recover
from the player you fail to sign than it is to recover from the one you sign at the wrong price.

Theoretically this will come down to two factors: the determination of the NYM GM/medical people and whether Borrea has another fish on
the line (Boras will of course claim he does) to pivot to if and when the Mets start making noises about fewer years and/or less money.
My fear is that Cohen may want the big splash/surprise heroics of all this too much and decide to go ahead with the deal even if the advice
of his paid experts tells him otherwise. Even if his side winds up being right in the long run it still sets an uneasy precedent.

So FK expresses some concern that the Correa deal might turn out badly for the Mets. Whatever. You could say that about any trade, I said, because the future is unknowable. Any deal could go bad and Cohen's not immune from those risks no matter how much money he has. The Mets made deals for Jason Bay and David Wright, for example, that turned out to be disastrous -- like Hindenburg-level disasters. It happens. I could give plenty more examples. But this is fine. This is the Correa Mets deal thread and this is the place to opine on that deal and discuss it.

But these two lines:

Yes it will, and maybe not signing Correa will ultimately be the better move given the MONEYBALL adage about it being easier to recover from the player you fail to sign than it is to recover from the one you sign at the wrong price.

and

My fear is that Cohen may want the big splash/surprise heroics of all this too much and decide to go ahead with the deal even if the advice of his paid experts tells him otherwise. Even if his side winds up being right in the long run it still sets an uneasy precedent.

This is what I was mainly addressing. That Cohen won't be able to recover from the Correa deal if it goes through and then goes bad? That a bad Correa deal would then doom Cohen to making bad deals forever and ever, going forward? I just thought that was too much and making too much of a big thing out of a possible bad outcome. And stressing Cohen's wealth wasn't straying from the topic, because Cohen's wealth is inextricably inked to the topic. In fact, Cohen's wealth is the topic. Much more so than acquiring Correa. Cohen's wealth would make it pretty easy to recover from a Correa deal gone bad. Cohen's a unicorn. Just like the laws of physics on this planet Earth don't apply to Superman or Clark Kent or anybody else from the planet Krypton, the regular laws of money and finance don't apply to Cohen they way they'd apply to most everybody else. It makes no sense to expect Cohen to spend his money like most everybody else. And it's starting to wear thin on me that people (not necessarily on this forum) everywhere treat Cohen like he is everybody else. He's a unicorn. If the rules permitted, he could own three MLB teams instead of just one. And then, the three teams with the highest payrolls would be the three teams that Cohen owns. He could recover from a bad Correa deal if it should go bad, easier than most people could recover from having to replace their refrigerator, ferchrissakes. So please spare me from the woe's me, he just spent $30 million on that player when $30M to Cohen is like a take-out pizza pie to just about anybody else. Wake me when the Mets payroll reaches three or four billion dollars and then maybe I'll show some concern. Maybe.

Steve Cohen's not gonna be here forever. He'll be 70 soon enough. This isn't like Nelson Doubleday, Jr. and Fred Wilpon buying into the Mets as relatively young men in their 40's. Let Cohen enjoy his money. Because he might not even have 10 years to bring home a WS title. Who knows?

[RealityChuck]

I need an update or my brain is going to implode like a neutron star.

Most reports say both sides very much want to do a deal. I expect they didn't talk much today.

The Mets still want him; this were a five-year deal, it would have gone through already. The problem seems to be that there a potential problems with the metal plate in the leg deteriorating and the Mets' concern is that it might happen in the latter half of the contract, if it does occur.

At the same time, Correa and Boras know that no team is going to give them a better deal.

I figure things will work out by the first.

[Edgy MD]

This is what I was mainly addressing. That Cohen won't be able to recover from the Correa deal if it goes through and then goes bad?

Nobody wrote that. Nobody.

That a bad Correa deal would then doom Cohen to making bad deals forever and ever, going forward?

Also suggested by no one.

And I certainly can't speak for everybody, but I'm certain that I don't need another analogy about how rich Steve Cohen is.

[Lefty Specialist]

I need an update or my brain is going to implode like a neutron star.

Most reports say both sides very much want to do a deal. I expect they didn't talk much today.

The Mets still want him; this were a five-year deal, it would have gone through already. The problem seems to be that there a potential problems with the metal plate in the leg deteriorating and the Mets' concern is that it might happen in the latter half of the contract, if it does occur.

At the same time, Correa and Boras know that no team is going to give them a better deal.

I figure things will work out by the first.

Yeah, this is where I am on this. Cohen ran his mouth and kinda committed himself here. Boras realizes that if TWO organizations hesitated due to the medicals, he's going to have difficulty shopping Correa any further. So he'll have to come to some kind of deal with Uncle Steve for a shorter term and cut his losses.

[batmagadanleadoff]

This is what I was mainly addressing. That Cohen won't be able to recover from the Correa deal if it goes through and then goes bad?

Nobody wrote that. Nobody.

Oh really? Nobody wrote that? My post in question came immediately after this:

Yes it will, and maybe not signing Correa will ultimately be the better move given the MONEYBALL adage about it being easier to recover
from the player you fail to sign than it is to recover from the one you sign at the wrong price.

which I was kind enough to reprint for a second time said quote about RECOVERING from the Correa deal after you first questioned my post.

So now what? You're gonna split hairs and now say that no one said that the Mets wouldn't recover from a bad Correa deal, but that instead, it'd be difficult?

It won't be difficult. It won't be difficult for a guy to whom thirty million dollars might as well be a bag of potato chips. Now what? Now you're gonna tell me again that you don't wanna be reminded about just how rich Steve Cohen is? Tough on you. Then don't create issues that can best be answered by demonstrating just how rich Steve Cohen is.

[Edgy MD]

If you want me to pretend one thing is another thing when it's not, I'm not going to, and neither is anybody else. The world doesn't work that way.

Please stop looking for fights where there are none to be had. A new year lies ahead and it's filled with so much potential.

[kcmets]

For posterity and regurgitation on slow news day...

Anthony DiComo of MLB.com reports that the Mets and free agent shortstop Carlos Correa are "actively working" to reach a resolution on their original contract agreement.

DiComo adds that the Mets were hoping to finalize Correa's 12-year, $315 million contract by Christmas, but will likely require a few additional days to reach a resolution after team officials expressed concerns regarding his medical records, specifically his surgically-repaired lower right leg. There isn't an exact timeline for the two sides to proceed, but there are zero indications that either side is walking away from the original agreement yet. The most likely outcome is the two sides agreeing to a re-structured contract that addresses New York's long-term medical concerns. Stay tuned.

RELATED: New York Mets
SOURCE: MLB.com
Dec 26, 2022, 8:20 AM ET

[batmagadanleadoff]

If you want me to pretend one thing is another thing when it's not, I'm not going to, and neither is anybody else. The world doesn't work that way.

Please stop looking for fights where there are none to be had. A new year lies ahead and it's filled with so much potential.

I wasn't looking for fights. You were. And as between you and me, you'd just the same extend a disagreement for two or three pages with baseless conclusions rather than ever concede anything to me. You've done it a zillion times already with me, going back to year one. I'm not looking for fights with anybody. I have issues with certain posters who indisputably started with me, and did so viciously and without any provocation on my end. These were arguments way beyond the boundaries of a baseball disagreement. These were repeated vicious personal attacks. Well, one guy not so viciously but just as bad because mocking me for ten years is pretty awful in and of itself. The only reason my disputes with that poster weren't these over the top armageddon flame wars was because I totally ignored him for 10 years. With him, it was more of a cumulative effect.

Gimme a break already with how difficult it'd be for Steve Cohen to recover from a bad Correa deal or how a bad Correa deal might set precedents and how nobody ever said that. He just finished paying the Orioles $19 million dollars to take James McCann, please. I woulda done it for a quarter of one million dollars. After signing Verlander and Senga and then a third baseman, Correa, whom he probably doesn't even need. This after making Scherzer, a 40 year old pitcher, the highest paid player in MLB history. Remember when Cohen signed Lindor? That felt like eons ago.

To tell you the truth, I can't wait till next off-season so I can see if the Mets sign Ohtani. The games themsleves are suddenly so anti-climactic. The Mets will likely make the playoffs and then probably get eliminated somewhere down the line. Yawn.

[Edgy MD]

Gimme a break already with how difficult it'd be for Steve Cohen to recover from a bad Correa deal or how a bad Correa deal might set precedents and how nobody ever said that.

I once looked up the word "break" on this forum. The only person who has ever asked to be given a break is you. And each and every instance I've found you to use the expression, nobody was actually giving you any grief or making the argument you accused them of. Nobody. You just decided to distort (or completely make up) something somebody wrote and get angry about it.

There is no break that you need. None.

I guess if denying that something write is true when I recognize it to be so is extending, then sure, I extend. I'll work on that. I can start by letting other posters let you know if you've mischaracterized them. I'm sorry if I step up prematurely.

But I'm the guy they write to when you do that over and over and over again. And I'm the guy left with a shittier forum when they leave. So please understand my temptation to engage and attempt to intercede.

[Edgy MD]

Here's a good song from my sig line.

[Edgy MD]

There's a nice summary of the history of Correa's ankles here. Also, you get to watch the same play 50 times.

[Frayed Knot]

NY Post; "one source" lists the chances at 55% of the Mets and Correa coming to an agreement.

[Lefty Specialist]

55%? Really? What does that even mean? It's a fancy way of saying "we don't know what's going to happen".

[kcmets]

I heard it's really 54.896%, guess the lazy Post just rounded up.

I don't expect any news this week. 86.837% of the offices involved in
such business are closed this week. Or 87%, if I may...

[Edgy MD]

I think it means Draft Kings now knows where to set the line. Get your money down!