Donald Trump in Hot Water

[Benjamin Grimm]

Verdict came back very quickly.

[Benjamin Grimm]

The jury has found that Carroll did not prove Trump raped her, but they did determine that he had sexually abused her. The jurors also found that Trump had defamed Carroll when he called her accusations false. They awarded her $5 million damages.

I'm not clear on how they could prove sexual abuse but not rape, but whatever. The $5 million won't hurt Trump's wallet, but it will piss him off, which will have to be good enough.

[nymr83]

The jury has found that Carroll did not prove Trump raped her, but they did determine that he had sexually abused her. The jurors also found that Trump had defamed Carroll when he called her accusations false. They awarded her $5 million damages.

I'm not clear on how they could prove sexual abuse but not rape, but whatever. The $5 million won't hurt Trump's wallet, but it will piss him off, which will have to be good enough.

Because nobody can 'prove' anything here - its a complete he said/she said, and the jury decided to split the baby.

oh well. sucks for the orange man!

[MFS62]

And somewhere, DeSantis is probably smiling smirking.
Later

[batmagadanleadoff]

The jury has found that Carroll did not prove Trump raped her, but they did determine that he had sexually abused her. The jurors also found that Trump had defamed Carroll when he called her accusations false. They awarded her $5 million damages.

I'm not clear on how they could prove sexual abuse but not rape, but whatever. The $5 million won't hurt Trump's wallet, but it will piss him off, which will have to be good enough.

Because nobody can 'prove' anything here - its a complete he said/she said, and the jury decided to split the baby.

oh well. sucks for the orange man!

The jury didn't have to split any baby. In NY, it's possible to sexually abuse somebody without committing rape. Rape requires penile penetration without consent.

[Edgy MD]

It's certainly not a he-said/she-said situation. At least not in court.

She said, and she offered nine corroborating witnesses. He decided not to say anything.

[Benjamin Grimm]

I guess I was wondering how they could be convinced that his fingers were in her vagina but not that his penis was. But then I remembered the Access Hollywood tape, where he bragged about "grabbing them by the pussy". That probably was the clincher for the sexual abuse charge.

[Edgy MD]

Along with corroborating testimony from the accuser in the 1979 account.

[Fman99]

CNN still putting him in their Town Hall. Despicable.

[nymr83]

CNN still putting him in their Town Hall. Despicable.

If CNN wants to take themselves seriously as a news organization rather than as a mouthpiece for a segment of the democratic party, they had damn well better move forward with him as planned - I hope the first question is about the civil case and the second about his indictment in NY

[Frayed Knot]

Also, he IS the front-runner (or at least A front-runner) for President from one of the two major parties. That makes him newsworthy whether we like it or not.
And the mistake people tend to make in this cancel culture/choose your own news era is to push the views of folks they don't like into the shadows. But we
shouldn't want those with wing nut views to get pushed into the shadows. I want those with wacko statements and their wacko selves pushed into the sunlight
for all to see and hear.

[Edgy MD]

Former-President Trump would have l-o-v-e LOVED to get pre-emptively kicked out of a CNN town hall.

[nymr83]

Former-President Trump would have l-o-v-e LOVED to get pre-emptively kicked out of a CNN town hall.

Well yes, that too.

[Edgy MD]

My real question is whether CNN should be doing these town halls at all. They're sort of a vestige of when CNN became so consumed with being a news leader that they began to create news events. What this amounted to was free coverage for a steamrolling asshole of a candidate, with his lies rolling out to quickly to deflect, and a friendly audience of yahoos cheering on his frequently successful efforts to live in his own reality. Perhaps they should cover events, but leave the creation to universities and such.

Also, I'd really like debates and candidate forums to move away from "What would you do?" scenario questions, which are frequently answered by cinematic fantasies projected onto a willing audience, and instead just give them middle school questions about civics and other disciplines.

1. What's the seventh amendment to the Constitution?
2. What's the capital of Missouri?
3. What's nine times 16?
4. What's the longest river in Asia?
5. What countries border Chad?
6. Please list The Five Pillars of Islam.
7. Please list The Beatitudes.
8. What is The Monroe Doctrine?
9. What was The Black Hole of Calcutta?
10. Please sum up the legacy of The Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire?
11. Who was Aimee Semple McPherson? What was her legacy?
12. What does "Filles du roi" mean?
13. Please describe The Code of Hammurabi. From what society does it originate? What period does it date to? In what form was it rediscovered? In what year did that take place? What are the overall doctrinal themes it speaks to? How many rules does it include? What are some of them?
14. Who is the head of state of Brazil?
15. What is the system of government in Egypt?
16. What is the purpose of the Sarbanes–Oxley Act? What has been its impact and legacy?
17. What is the mission of The House Ways & Means Committee? Who is the chair? Who is the vice-chair? What is currently on their agenda?
18. What is The Who's best b-side? Why?
19. What year did Montana achieve statehood? Who are some of the indigenous peoples whose history there pre-dates the arrival of American expansion?
20. Who were the combatants in the First Barbary War? What were the years? Where was it contested? What issues triggered it? What were some battles? How was it resolved?

[TransMonk]

I'm not too upset that CNN did it...though, they could have done better. Not picking the audience members from the basket of deplorables would have been a start.

Frankly, I think everyone got what they wanted/needed out of it:
CNN got a staged-entertainment ratings-fest.
Kaitlan Collins will get a 9PM prime time slot at CNN.
Trump got a televised rally.
Biden got advertising that writes itself.
Moderates got reintroduced to why they dislike Trump after not hearing him speak for over an hour in a while.

[Edgy MD]

Me, personally, I didn't get what I wanted.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I wouldn't have given him that Town Hall. Let FOX host it. Or Newsmax. He's not a normal candidate. Like he gives a flying fuck about inflation or what people pay for medicines. He's a psychopath running on an authoritarian dictatorship platform. And that's not hype. January 6 was a splendid day and he'd pardon convicted insurrectionists, according to him. He exhorted the House to enable a default on the debt. Wanna know why? Because he's a psychopath and he'd truly enjoy all of the catastrophic human suffering and misery that a default would cause.

By the way, where's that forum member who was writing a post every other day, gloating over Gov. Cuomo's political problems and declaring Cuomo the worst politician in America because he used his clout to ask some of his employees for dates? What's he got to say about the politician who was found to be a sexual abuser by a Federal jury earlier this week and who has over two dozen other credible accusations of sexual abuse and rape? He's probably already standing in line at the polling place, ready to vote for him again in 2024.

[Edgy MD]

I don't know of whom you speak. Got a name?

[batmagadanleadoff]

I don't know of whom you speak. Got a name?

Trump. What other candidate just got a Town Hall?

[Edgy MD]

I was responding to your question about the poster.

[batmagadanleadoff]

I was responding to your question about the poster.

You know everything that goes on in this here forum. Stop gaslighting me already, like you've been doing with the guy who abused me for 10 years running, pretending all along that none of it ever happened so that you could rationalize taking his side every single time.

[Edgy MD]

I asked a question, in honesty, to gain clarity about a question you asked. Given two chances to answer, you've given me two sarcastic responses and an imperative, followed by an equally obscure accusation. Please don't do that. Please don't do any of that. It's miserable.

If you don't want a response, please don't ask questions.

[Edgy MD]

Discovery documents in the "hush money" case have revealed that the prosecution has, among their evidence, recording of a conversation between the the former president and a witness.

Michael Cohen has suggested in the past that he has made of a habit of keeping recordings of conversations when he could — a practice initially undertaken at his old boss' insistence.

[MFS62]

GOTCHA'!

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Federal prosecutors have a 2021 audio recording of former President Donald Trump acknowledging he kept a classified Pentagon document about a possible attack on Iran after leaving the White House, CNN reported on Wednesday.
CNN did not listen to the recording but cited unidentified multiple sources describing it. Reuters was not able to confirm the report.

and

The recording shows Trump, who is seeking the 2024 Republican presidential nomination, understood he retained classified material after he left the White House in 2021, according to the cable television network.
Trump’s remarks indicated he would like to share the information but was aware of the limitations on his ability to declassify documents after leaving office, two sources told CNN.

So:(My summarizing remarks to the jury in my best Sam Waterston voice)
1) He had them
2) He knew he shouldn't have them
3) He wanted to share them.
4) He knew he couldn't share them.
5) He admitted to not being able to declassify documents
Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, you have no choice but to vote guilty.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/31/politics ... ran-milley
Later

[Edgy MD]

We still have a lot to learn about motive. Did he have the docs because he was grabby? Because he liked the trappings of pretending he's president? To show off to folks? To leverage members of the government? To buy favor with foreign interests?

He's an incredible story, in that he's now being criminally incriminated by recordings of his own voice in two entirely different cases.

And he's running for president. And he's winning.