The Crane Pool Forum

This is usually my least favorite list of the year as the Rock Hall means something different to a lot of people. However, this year I think the nominees are the strongest list ever and I can make an argument for any and all of them.

I'm going to need some time to narrow the list down. What do you think? You can vote for up to six nominees as typically five to seven acts get in each year.

2023 Nominees:
Kate Bush
Sheryl Crow
Missy Elliott
Iron Maiden
Joy Division/New Order
Cyndi Lauper
George Michael
Willie Nelson
Rage Against the Machine
Soundgarden
The Spinners
A Tribe Called Quest
The White Stripes
Warren Zevon

I'm a tough judge and won't vote for anyone that did drugs

The argument that Kate Bush is only getting a shot because of the resurgent success of "Running Up That Hill" seems dumb to me, and if anything, proves the opposite. If a song is still a banger almost 30 years later, that might just be HOF magic, baby.

I fear A Tribe Called Quest = David Wright.

Lastly, Willie Nelson is an American treasure and should probably be in all the halls of fame just because.

metirish wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 11:20 am I'm a tough judge and won't vote for anyone that did drugs

And no cheaters. Auto-tune? Overdubs? HELL NO.

Also, it feels weird that Joy Division and New Order are nominated together like one band.

NOW they finally get around to acknowledging the existence of Warren Zevon?!?

Frayed Knot wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 12:33 pm NOW they finally get around to acknowledging the existence of Warren Zevon?!?

Right? Brilliant song writer and musician

A Boy Named Seo wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 12:19 pm Also, it feels weird that Joy Division and New Order are nominated together like one band.

There's precedent here. The Small Faces and The Faces went in as a single act. And while the names may have been more similar than JD/NO, their personnel and their sounds were more distinct from one another. It can be argued that Fleetwood Mac were three or four different bands with the same drummer and bassist.

FUN FACTS: While it's common knowledge that they were Joy Division before they were New Order, before that, they were called Poland. And before that, they were Stiff Kitten.

They should be inducted under all four names.

Or just induct them as:
The New Stiff Polish Kittens Division

I refuse to acknowledge the RNR HOF members, nominees or performers. It's all total bullshit. You've got Eminem and Whitney Houston in, but you don't have INXS or Jethro Tull or Foreigner or Boston. Eat a garbage bag full of dicks, phony museum.

Jethro Tull is in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. (On Edit: WRONG!)

Foreigner is just a bad act. They do however qualify for the Album Cover Featuring an Underage Girl Sitting in the Urinal of a Disgusting Men's Room Hall of Fame. A first-ballot choice, probably.

No, Jethro Tull is not in the R&RHOF.

Edgy MD wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 1:57 pm

A Boy Named Seo wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 12:19 pm Also, it feels weird that Joy Division and New Order are nominated together like one band.

There's precedent here. The Small Faces and The Faces went in as a single act. And while the names may have been more similar than JD/NO, their personnel and their sounds were more distinct from one another. It can be argued that Fleetwood Mac were three or four different bands with the same drummer and bassist.

Fleetwood Mac was three or four different bands. (Extreme emphasis on "different").

Edgy MD wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 3:36 pm Jethro Tull is in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.

Like sharpie said, Tull is not in the R&R HOF. But if they were, they'd be like 10 or 15 different bands, maybe even 25 -- I lost count, given all the personnel changes Tull went through since its debut, more than 50 years ago. I guess the HOF inducts the name of the band. It's like the Seinfeld joke about rooting for the uniforms instead of the actual team.

Fman99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 3:28 pm I refuse to acknowledge the RNR HOF members, nominees or performers. It's all total bullshit. You've got Eminem and Whitney Houston in, but you don't have INXS or Jethro Tull or Foreigner or Boston. Eat a garbage bag full of dicks, phony museum.

I pretty much lean here. Except the part about Foreigner. Or Boston. Unless putting out one remarkable and ground-breaking debut album qualifies. Dwight Gooden isn't in his HOF and he might be the best debuting baller in the whole history of MLB. He was robbed of his rightful legacy. H's a rookie of the year and in his second season, a Cy Young Award winner. But he deserved to win the Cy in each of his first two seasons and should also have an MVP award in his trophy room.

I have no idea what this R&R HOF is all about but I don't gripe about it since I see it as mostly for fun and to celebrate the great R&R music. I mean, I get it when the obvious performers like the Beatles or Little Richard or U2 are inducted. But so much more of it is so head-scratching.

It's much easier to vote for the two-headed entry of Joy Division/New Order than it would be to give one vote each if you split them up (although NO had six albums of 4 stars or more on AMG). Fleetwood Mac didn't do themselves any harm by keeping the brand in tact even with a revolving cast, did they?

Indeed. As it was much easier to vote for the two-headed entry of The Small Faces/The Faces than it was to give one vote each if you split them up.

I voted for five and waffled on both The Spinners and Iron Maiden.

The Spinners had a great, but short peak (5 albums > 4 stars on AMG) between '73-'75. But seemingly a critically mediocre band from '77 to present and only one founding member remaining over the same period, making The Spinners feel like a Spinners cover group. They seem like the Bobby Abreu of this ballot. Sneaky good back of the baseball card stats, real peaky peak, and a longevity that maybe didn't do a great deal to elevate their legacy. Am I way off?

Iron Maiden. They seem to me like the Harold Baines of this ballot. Long career, considered the best at what they do for maybe a couple album cycles (or am I underrating Maiden?). 27 albums, 10 of which got 4 stars or more on AMG, 17 different members, and apparently still going strong.

From their AMG bio:

One of the first groups to be classified as "British metal," Iron Maiden helped set the table for the hard rock/heavy metal scene of the '80s and inspired generations of subsequent bands, including Metallica, Dream Theater, Slipknot, In Flames, and Avenged Sevenfold.

We can blame them for Slipknot? That makes me want to vote for them less. Where are you on Iron Maiden?

I wouldn't get too committed to AMG's rankings. I just ask: did they influence, establish, define, or advance for a period the supergenre that is rock 'n' roll? How much? For how long? More than other worthy candidates?

A Boy Named Seo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 03, 2023 12:18 pm from '77 to present and only one founding member remaining over the same period, making The Spinners feel like a Spinners cover group.

Four-fifths of the group that came together in the 1950s — Billy Henderson, Pervis Jackson, Bobby Smith and the still kicking Henry Fambrough — stayed together, give or take an Uncle Sam-mandated army stint, and recorded and toured as a unit until mortality came knocking in the 21st century. The Spinners I saw in the late 1990s were the Spinners who got their foot in the door at Motown and crashed the shores of stardom at Atlantic. The only ‘x’ factor was the absence, after their imperial period, of the mercurial Philippé Wynn, who left to pursue the solo spotlight (ultimately suffering a fatal heart attack on stage). Wynne, who succeeded G.C. Cameron (lead voice on “It’s A Shame”), was succeeded for a very long time by (not the senator) John Edwards. Cameron returned to fill in for Edwards after Edwards’s stroke.

Edwards, by the way, could bring it.



Today, it’s Fambrough and four members who’ve been phased in over time continuing to please audiences everywhere, as The Spinners as they can be.

What a terrific sleeve that single had.

A Boy Named Seo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 03, 2023 12:18 pm The Spinners had a great, but short peak (5 albums > 4 stars on AMG) between '73-'75. But seemingly a critically mediocre band from '77 to present and only one founding member remaining over the same period, making The Spinners feel like a Spinners cover group. They seem like the Bobby Abreu of this ballot. Sneaky good back of the baseball card stats, real peaky peak, and a longevity that maybe didn't do a great deal to elevate their legacy. Am I way off?

Everything you said is true. Because what they did was really good. Even if you weren't a big music fan back then, you can still remember the words to most of their songs today. And those songs still hold up.
To use your baseball analogy, IMO they had a brief, excellent run, like Sandy Koufax.

I'm surprised they aren't already in the Hall. When I saw them on the list, they were the first one I checked off. The others were Cheryl Crow and George Michael.
Later

Fman99 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 02, 2023 3:28 pm I refuse to acknowledge the RNR HOF members, nominees or performers. It's all total bullshit. You've got Eminem and Whitney Houston in, but you don't have INXS or Jethro Tull or Foreigner or Boston. Eat a garbage bag full of dicks, phony museum.

I know this doesn't address your beef, Fman, but how in the shit is Eminem in any Hall of Fame that doesn't have Dr. Dre as a member before him? Also, Whitney was a GIANT in popular music. What is rock 'n roll if not a branch of the tree of popular music?

Side questions -
what is rock 'n roll?
Is rock 'n roll "over"?
Who are influential rock 'n roll bands in 2023 that started 5 years ago or less?

Buying a pawn shop guitar and starting a garage band feels as far removed from contemporary popular culture as Pepsi Free and Tivo. Is guitar-based rock 'n roll hibernating? I thought that Strokes/NYC 2000s scene pumped new blood in RnR, but in retrospect, maybe it was just a revival cycle.

Old guy out.

My favorite rock writer reveals his HOF ballot:

https://uproxx.com/indie/steven-hyden-b ... l-of-fame/

This is a funny line, in the Willie Nelson part. I'm not sure I agree with him, but a good line!:

He is so great and consequential that he seems way bigger than the Rock Hall. The honor almost diminishes him. It’s like the federal government giving Abraham Lincoln an “Employee Of The Month” award.

This is good, too, about Warren Zevon.

He’s the least famous person here. He has (I’m guessing) sold the fewest records. He has the most checkered past, and (again, I’m guessing) he has personally alienated the most voters. (He has been dead for 20 years, but he had a huge lead in the “alienated industry people” department.)

A Boy Named Seo wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 5:12 pm My favorite rock writer reveals his HOF ballot:

https://uproxx.com/indie/steven-hyden-b ... l-of-fame/

Is this satire? He's voting NO for Joy Division/ New Order because they don't need his vote ?

Anyway, agree hugely on Zvon